Joe Webb (Moving Forward)

[Cliff]

Webb gets to run the read-option against the Packers and moves the ball well. They try to turn him into a pocket passer the rest of the game with disastrous results. The Niners allow Kaepernick to run the read option all game against the Packers and win.

I'm not saying Webb = Kaepernick, I think Kaep has a much larger skillset he brings to the table. However, Webb was never given a chance to succeed in that game. They took away the one chance they had to try and fit him into a mold he will never conform to. I think we need to move on from Webb, at the least he's not a west coast QB and at most he's not a QB at all.

Well ... they moved the ball pretty well for the first handful of plays. The Packers had adjusted by the end of the first drive which stalled out at the 15 yard line and they settled for a field goal.

Like you said, it also helps that Kaepernick has a larger skillset that Webb lacks. The option just isn't as strong when your QB isn't a real threat to throw the ball as well as run it. I can't see that game going much better had they stuck with a "run 90% of the time" offense.

[mansquatch]

The difference between a Webb lead Vikings O and the 49ers is that the Packers had to resepect the WR/Te of the 49ers. When CK ran for huge yardage it was because they were playing coverage that had most of the secondary 20+ yards down the field. This meant CK only had to break through the LOS and make a LB miss to get 10+ yards.

By contrast, the Vikings had no one the Packers D feared running patterns aside from maybe KR who is not a deep threat. Couple that with a back up QB who hadn't shown he could pass accurately plus a game plan built to stop the rushing attack and now you are running read option against 8-9 bodies stacked up at the LOS.

I think Webb could be more successful than he was against GB (an overall bed defense) with better WR, but is that enough to justify his backup QB roster spot? I'm not sure it is. We alrady have #28 running all over the place, unless Webb can complete passes, he is akin to adding another RB that also tosses a lot of incomplete passes which makes the defense even more run oriented.

Bottom line is Webb needs to at least be a threat to complete 50+% of his passes before he'll ever have the lanes the Read Option can create. So far he hasn't shown he can make that happen with any amount of regularity. It is too bad because I suspect his athletic ability is on par with RGIII.

[Texas Vike]

Why would you doubt that Harvin would have the same commitment to make a block for Ponder that he showed on the play you described?

Well, for one, I've never seen Percy put that much effort into a possible block for anyone, much less Ponder, but maybe I've just never noticed how great he is at blocking.

Just to take one obvious example, I honestly have a hard time imagining Percy working this hard to spring Ponder during the Seahawks game after he appeared to me to be pretty upset with Ponder's inability to throw a 3 yard bubble screen w/ any accuracy. I recognize that this is speculation on my part, but I don't think I'm just seeing shapes in the clouds.

If anyone has a video of Percy working his tail off to throw a killer block for Ponder I'd be happy to see it and change my mind.

[dead_poet]

I've never seen Percy put that much effort into a block for anyone.

You haven't watched him block for AD then.

[Texas Vike]

You haven't watched him block for AD then.

Seems like I've touched a nerve for some of you! Not my intention... y'all seem a bit touchy up there... Is that cold weather getting you ornery? It's 70 and sunny here today!

[PurpleMustReign]

Seems like I've touched a nerve for some of you! Not my intention... y'all seem a bit touchy up there... Is that cold weather getting you ornery? It's 70 and sunny here today!

Classy.

Sent from my SGH-T769 using Tapatalk 2

[Laserman]

Make him a WR or get rid of him. waste of roster space. Just can't bank on potential

[Mothman]

Just to take one obvious example, I honestly have a hard time imagining Percy working this hard to spring Ponder during the Seahawks game after he appeared to me to be pretty upset with Ponder's inability to throw a 3 yard bubble screen w/ any accuracy. I recognize that this is speculation on my part, but I don't think I'm just seeing shapes in the clouds.

Well, he was definitely angry in that game but despite popular opinion, I'm still not convinced he was all that angry about Ponder's poor throw on that bubble screen. He looked frustrated on the play, as any player would, but his angry display came after the next play, when a Seattle blitzer came in unblocked and sacked Ponder. When Harvin was yelling at Frazier on the sideline after the play, he clearly used the word sack so was he all worked up about Ponder's throw or the fact that the Vikings blew the end of the drive and had to settle for a FG? Maybe he was angry at the playcalling.

If anyone has a video of Percy working his tail off to throw a killer block for Ponder I'd be happy to see it and change my mind.

I plan to re-watch some of the games this offseason so if I see one, I'll let you know. I just see no reason why Harvin wouldn't be as willing to work hard and throw a block for Ponder as he would for Webb. Harvin seems like a player who works hard and wants to win, not someone who would hold back effort because his QB missed him on a bubble screen or two. After all, Ponder's been good for Harvin's career. Percy's production picked up when Ponder became the starter in 2011 and he continued to be one of the most targeted, productive WRs in the league while he was healthy in 2012.

FWIW, you didn't touch a nerve with me. I just don't think Harvin would give more or less effort for one QB than the the other.

[Texas Vike]

Well, he was definitely angry in that game but despite popular opinion, I'm still not convinced he was all that angry about Ponder's poor throw on that bubble screen. He looked frustrated on the play, as any player would, but his angry display came after the next play, when a Seattle blitzer came in unblocked and sacked Ponder. When Harvin was yelling at Frazier on the sideline after the play, he clearly used the word sack so was he all worked up about Ponder's throw or the fact that the Vikings blew the end of the drive and had to settle for a FG? Maybe he was angry at the playcalling.
I plan to re-watch some of the games this offseason so if I see one, I'll let you know. I just see no reason why Harvin wouldn't be as willing to work hard and throw a block for Ponder as he would for Webb. Harvin seems like a player who works hard and wants to win, not someone who would hold back effort because his QB missed him on a bubble screen or two. After all, Ponder's been good for Harvin's career. Percy's production picked up when Ponder became the starter in 2011 and he continued to be one of the most targeted, productive WRs in the league while he was healthy in 2012.

FWIW, you didn't touch a nerve with me. I just don't think Harvin would give more or less effort for one QB than the the other.

Percy is, without a doubt, a fierce competitor, which is why I think we have to do whatever it takes to keep him. He has that same intensity that I just love in AD. There are times when he just will NOT be denied. My suspicion could be way off, but I get the sense that part of Percy's frustrations have come from subpar QB play over the years. I admit that I have no idea what he thinks of Ponder's competence at the position. He's done a good job of not speaking much publicly about whatever issues he's had.

Please do post any vids of Percy blocking you find. It would be interesting to see.

[Delaqure]

Make him a WR or get rid of him. waste of roster space. Just can't bank on potential

I agree. We have all heard what a gifted athelete Webb is. But to me that is just short for "he can't paly any position well enough to be a starter." I am tired of "projects." We need players who can play the position they are hired to play. I don't want a "project" receiver or running back or heaven forbid a project QB. To me it is time to let him go and get someone on the roster who really can play the position if need be.

[Purple bruise]

Seems like I've touched a nerve for some of you! Not my intention... y'all seem a bit touchy up there... Is that cold weather getting you ornery? It's 70 and sunny here today!

Uh..... you did not touch any nerves that I know of but you did post something that to me sounds pretty ridiculous about Harvin blocking "hard" for Webb but would not do the same blocking for Ponder

[Mothman]

Percy is, without a doubt, a fierce competitor, which is why I think we have to do whatever it takes to keep him. He has that same intensity that I just love in AD. There are times when he just will NOT be denied. My suspicion could be way off, but I get the sense that part of Percy's frustrations have come from subpar QB play over the years. I admit that I have no idea what he thinks of Ponder's competence at the position. He's done a good job of not speaking much publicly about whatever issues he's had.

Please do post any vids of Percy blocking you find. It would be interesting to see.

I'd probably have to post screenshots but either way, if I see some good examples I'll post them.

[Mothman]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMg4em-zFtw

Looks like he said, he cant even throw the damn football coach, this is BS.

Even if that's what he said, was he referring to the fact that Ponder didn't even get a chance to throw the football on the play preceding the rant or was he referring to the poor pass a play earlier? There's no way to know and that's exactly the point. I think a lot of people assumed he was upset with Ponder because they were upset with Ponder. heck, Harvin may have been upset at all of it! It was an ugly sequence.

[Just Me]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMg4em-zFtw


Looks like he said, he cant even throw the damn football coach, this is BS.

Could also be bad lip reading on my part but i'm just saying. I was there at that game and you could see him ranting from our seats.

I think he said, "You've got an orange peanut? For me?"

[Texas Vike]

I think he said, "You've got an orange peanut? For me?"