Vikings WRs and 2016 draft

[Pondering Her Percy]

Moderator's Note:

This thread was "Vikings Defense" but comments Mike (Pondering her Percy) made below led to a conversation about the draft and WRs that had nothing to do with defense and since it was early in the "life" of the thread, I've split the two discussions into two different threads.

Mike's comments begin below this note.

— Jim

All I know is, this is the best Vikings defense I think I have ever personally seen. The speed and power on this defense is ridiculous and our pass defense has been amazing. I truly believe there is only one true hole on this defense right now and it's SS. I like the way Greenway is playing for his age and I think he could be replaced in a year or so by a 4th/5th round LB or maybe someone via FA. Robison has played well for the most part as well but I think we already have his replacement in Hunter. We have Waynes sitting in the wings for when Newman retires.

Spielman and Zimmer have done an UNBELIEVABLE job building this defense. We were the 31st ranked defense 2 years ago and now look how good they are and how young they are. I hope Spielman and Zim focus a little more on offense in this upcoming draft. Offensive line and WR specifically.

I would love to see our draft go as follows:

Round 1: WR or OL
Round 2: SS
Round 3: WR or OL
Round 4: OLB or OL (again)
Round 5: OLB or OL (again)

We really don't have very many holes on this team. And this is why I've defended Spielman for the past few years because in 2012 we pretty much started a COMPLETE rebuild and the way he has drafted over the past 3 years, this team was bound for success. Bringing in one of the better coaches in the NFL helped a ton as well. Spielman is a top 10 GM IMO right now. From what he started with in 2012 until now, I think he has definitely started to prove himself.

[mansquatch]

Spielman and Zimmer have done an UNBELIEVABLE job building this defense. We were the 31st ranked defense 2 years ago and now look how good they are and how young they are. I hope Spielman and Zim focus a little more on offense in this upcoming draft. Offensive line and WR specifically.

I would love to see our draft go as follows:

Round 1: WR or OL
Round 2: SS
Round 3: WR or OL
Round 4: OLB or OL (again)
Round 5: OLB or OL (again)

We really don't have very many holes on this team. And this is why I've defended Spielman for the past few years because in 2012 we pretty much started a COMPLETE rebuild and the way he has drafted over the past 3 years, this team was bound for success. Bringing in one of the better coaches in the NFL helped a ton as well. Spielman is a top 10 GM IMO right now. From what he started with in 2012 until now, I think he has definitely started to prove himself.

If they take another WR in the first 3 rounds in the next draft I'll vomit. They have plenty of depth there and an arguably bloated contract. OL/SS are huge needs right now and should be addressed early.

[UKno1VIKING]

All I know is, this is the best Vikings defense I think I have ever personally seen. The speed and power on this defense is ridiculous and our pass defense has been amazing. I truly believe there is only one true hole on this defense right now and it's SS. I like the way Greenway is playing for his age and I think he could be replaced in a year or so by a 4th/5th round LB or maybe someone via FA. Robison has played well for the most part as well but I think we already have his replacement in Hunter. We have Waynes sitting in the wings for when Newman retires.

Spielman and Zimmer have done an UNBELIEVABLE job building this defense. We were the 31st ranked defense 2 years ago and now look how good they are and how young they are. I hope Spielman and Zim focus a little more on offense in this upcoming draft. Offensive line and WR specifically.

I would love to see our draft go as follows:

Round 1: WR or OL
Round 2: SS
Round 3: WR or OL
Round 4: OLB or OL (again)
Round 5: OLB or OL (again)

We really don't have very many holes on this team. And this is why I've defended Spielman for the past few years because in 2012 we pretty much started a COMPLETE rebuild and the way he has drafted over the past 3 years, this team was bound for success. Bringing in one of the better coaches in the NFL helped a ton as well. Spielman is a top 10 GM IMO right now. From what he started with in 2012 until now, I think he has definitely started to prove himself.

Next years draft should go:
1. OL
2. OL
3. OL
4. OL
5. OL
6. Punter

[Mothman]

If they take another WR in the first 3 rounds in the next draft I'll vomit. They have plenty of depth there and an arguably bloated contract.

I assume you're referring to Wallace's contract but he can be cut after this season with no cap hit so it's very unlikely he'll be back unless it's under a re-worked contract.

[dead_poet]

If they take another WR in the first 3 rounds in the next draft I'll vomit. They have plenty of depth there and an arguably bloated contract. OL/SS are huge needs right now and should be addressed early.

I agree with the OL being the priority but WR, which looked to be a position of strength at the beginning of the season, is really not looking like it right now. Of course, how much of that is the product of the OL and QB? But if/when Wallace is gone, do we really want to trust CJ to be a starter (assuming Patterson's role stays what it is)? I know he did some decent things last season but he's looking to me like more of a #3 receiver. I do want to pair Teddy up with a taller, more physical WR. Laquon Treadwell would be an intriguing addition and Clemson's Mike Williams may be a value pick due to a neck injury sustained earlier this year. But of course OL remains the priority. And SS is up there, too. Perhaps safety could be addressed via free agency with a guy like Tashaun Gipson or George Iloka.

[mansquatch]

CJ is more the possession type guy IMO while Diggs has more explosiveness. Patterson is a wild card. We are paying Wallace to be #1 / field stretcher and he can and does do that. We also have a solid #2/#3 slot/speed guy in Jarius Wright. Point is, that is Five guys who all are viable for extended snaps. Yes, we are missing that big, physical guy, like a Dez Bryant or Anquan Boldin, but isn't that why we have Ellison/Rudolph?

However in terms of improving the team, does taking a chance on getting that big physical guy outweigh the impact of shoring up OL or adding talent at DE, LB, CB, or S? My opinion is that unless you've got a guy who has enormous BPA talent, the value to the team is likely to be much higher at these other position groups given their weakness on the roster.

[Mothman]

CJ is more the possession type guy IMO while Diggs has more explosiveness. Patterson is a wild card. We are paying Wallace to be #1 / field stretcher and he can and does do that.

Again, he's due to make $11,500 next year and they can cut him without a hit to their cap. he has 28 catches for 318 yards and 1 TD after 11 games this year and no apparent chemistry with Bridgewater. In other words, it's very unlikely he'll be a Viking in 2016.

[losperros]

I agree with the OL being the priority but WR, which looked to be a position of strength at the beginning of the season, is really not looking like it right now. Of course, how much of that is the product of the OL and QB? But if/when Wallace is gone, do we really want to trust CJ to be a starter (assuming Patterson's role stays what it is)? I know he did some decent things last season but he's looking to me like more of a #3 receiver. I do want to pair Teddy up with a taller, more physical WR. Laquon Treadwell would be an intriguing addition and Clemson's Mike Williams may be a value pick due to a neck injury sustained earlier this year. But of course OL remains the priority. And SS is up there, too. Perhaps safety could be addressed via free agency with a guy like Tashaun Gipson or George Iloka.

If Patterson's role remains the same, which is waste away on the bench, then he might be gone next year.

I don't know about Charles Johnson. Could he be a better choice than Wallace out there? How can anyone tell? The guy doesn't get played that often, which I think is crazy. Johnson showed enough last season that he should get a big look before being dismissed as a #3 or #4 WR. I'm interested in what a WR tandem like Johnson and Diggs would be like. YMMV

[losperros]

CJ is more the possession type guy IMO while Diggs has more explosiveness. Patterson is a wild card. We are paying Wallace to be #1 / field stretcher and he can and does do that.

Johnson has 4.38/40 speed. He's blazing fast and can stretch the field, so I don't think he's just a possession guy.

I've been wondering why the Vikings don't try CJ deep more often since he had good chemistry with Bridgewater last year. Better than Wallace does this year.

[dead_poet]

If Patterson's role remains the same, which is waste away on the bench, then he might be gone next year.

That'd be pretty stupid. He's still a special teams asset and he's only scheduled to make a little over $1 million, the last year of his rookie contract. At worst he's cheap depth and contributor on special teams.

I don't know about Charles Johnson. Could he be a better choice than Wallace out there? How can anyone tell? The guy doesn't get played that often, which I think is crazy. Johnson showed enough last season that he should get a big look before being dismissed as a #3 or #4 WR. I'm interested in what a WR tandem like Johnson and Diggs would be like. YMMV

I'm mildly curious as well, mostly because I want to see anyone else out there with Diggs. But before his injury CJ wasn't really contributing either. Put another way, he had been as invisible before his injury this year as he was impactful at the end of last season. He really doesn't inspire much confidence in me as an outside threat in any capacity but I'm willing to give him more opportunities. I suspect he'll have them next year if/when Wallace is gone.

[Texas Vike]

I agree that WR should be a priority in the top 4 rounds.

OL and SS are our top needs, but WR is close behind, and if a value pick should fall to us, I'd want us to make a move.

A guy that I think may drop into the 2nd round (undeservedly) because of injury is Josh Doctson from TCU.

Here's a highlight video (mute the volume): [youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2fd7A14Ubo[/youtube]

Notice how he high points the ball, catches with his hands, is tall and fast. The guy is going to excel at the next level, IMO.


Career stats: 215 receptions, 3178 yards, 34 TDS; most of his production was in the last two years.

[Norv Zimmer]

If they take another WR in the first 3 rounds in the next draft I'll vomit. They have plenty of depth there and an arguably bloated contract. OL/SS are huge needs right now and should be addressed early.

I think the chance of drafting a OL where we will be drafting around 23rd I am thinking is low. I don't think there is much difference between a late first round OL than a 3rd round OL.
Wr on the other hand can be found in the late first round and be great.

[Purple bruise]

If they take another WR in the first 3 rounds in the next draft I'll vomit. They have plenty of depth there and an arguably bloated contract. OL/SS are huge needs right now and should be addressed early.

I gotta agree, the last thing I could imagine them taking in the 1st or 2nd round would be a WR.. Actually the position is pretty sound especially if they could somehow get "hands of stone Wallace" in to the scheme (personally I would like to see him gone.
Offensive line and Safety are their primary needs. I would not mind them taking another quality LB or corner but no way WR.

[Texas Vike]

I gotta agree, the last thing I could imagine them taking in the 1st or 2nd round would be a WR.. Actually the position is pretty sound especially if they could somehow get "hands of stone Wallace" in to the scheme (personally I would like to see him gone.
Offensive line and Safety are their primary needs. I would not mind them taking another quality LB or corner but no way WR.

Lots of vomit going around, but after hurling, I hear folks saying a lot of "if" this and "if" that....

To me, that's a testament to the fact that our WR corps APPEAR to be strong, but they really are not. Wallace, CJ, and Patterson have all been less than we thought they'd be. Diggs and Jarius are the only bright spots IMO. We can and should get better at the position.

[Cliff]

Lots of vomit going around, but after hurling, I hear folks saying a lot of "if" this and "if" that....

To me, that's a testament to the fact that our WR corps APPEAR to be strong, but they really are not. Wallace, CJ, and Patterson have all been less than we thought they'd be. Diggs and Jarius are the only bright spots IMO. We can and should get better at the position.

I wouldn't be upset if we lost all the WRs on the roster not named Diggs. Not saying we should just that I wouldn't be upset. The rest are all pretty 'meh' for me with the exception of Wright. However, if Diggs keeps it up he'll take pressure off of the rest and that could allow players like Wright to shine who is pretty good in his own right.

The rest of the WRs I want to keep because they could be good for the team. Johnson looked good and it would be nice if he could keep that up but the past tells us he probably won't. Wallace has proven playmaking ability but doesn't seem to be a good fit in the offense. Even Patterson has possibility if his raw talent and knowledge of the game can meet.

Like you said, a lot of "ifs". If Wallace can regain form in the offense. If Johnson proves his good games were flukes. If Patterson can catch on and gets a chance. I don't consider WR close to strong. As fans we might have thought that before the season but it should be clear to anyone now that the position needs attention.

That said, I'm generally not a fan of drafting WRs high in the first place so I wouldn't want that either unless there's a 'can't miss' kind of prospect.