PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

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Mothman
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by Mothman »

mansquatch wrote:Or in short, you also need a defense.

I can agree that our offense was pedestrian, that conclusion seems beyond reproach. However, I'm not 100% on the anti-Norv bandwagon. I really wonder how much of what we saw last year was a result of Norv vs the situation, injury wise, on the OL. To be fair, if you know you can't reliably protect well enough for the deep passing game, then you are much less likely to incorporate it


The thing is, he tried to incorporate it.

TexasVike touched on an important point: Bridgewater doesn't throw the long ball very well and he hasn't been much of a risk-taker in the Vikings offense. I think the impact that's had on the offense has been seriously underestimated. Turner's system calls for a lot of mid-range passing punctuated by deep throws and yet, with Bridgewater, we've seen FAR more short passing and checking down than anything else. He's reluctant to throw the seams and posts that are staples of the offense (except, apparently, to Rudolph) and his anticipation is lacking too often in a system that needs it to thrive. There are other issues (predictability, blocking) but QB performance may have had as much impact on the lackluster passing game as anything else. It may even have had the most impact. After all, QB is typically considered the most important position in football for good reason.

I refer everyone back to this brief article posted on PFT's site in December, right before Bridgewater had a great game against the Bears:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... minnesota/

It's old so I'll just post the whole thing:
Vikings quarterback Teddy Bridgewater has thrown just three touchdown passes in Minnesota’s last six games, and that’s a growing concern for those who watch Bridgewater closely.

Bridgewater’s nine touchdown passes this year are by far the fewest in the NFL among quarterbacks who have started every game, and his six completions of 40 or more yards are tied for the fewest among quarterbacks who have started every game. (A lot of quarterbacks who haven’t started every game are ahead of Bridgewater in both statistical categories, too.)

Accuracy on downfield throws has been an issue for Bridgewater, who doesn’t have a strong arm and struggles to find receivers deep. On ESPN’s NFL Matchup this week, Merril Hoge showed tape of Bridgewater missing an open Mike Wallace for what should have been a touchdown pass, and Hoge noted that it was a play that had been designed perfectly for Wallace to get open downfield — it just wasn’t executed properly by Bridgewater.

“It’s Mike Wallace that you create a one-on-one matchup for. Your fastest guy over there. You get speed, you get one-on-one, he’s wide open, and it’s not even close,” Hoge said of Bridgewater’s pass.

The Vikings are having a good season and heading toward the playoffs, but Bridgewater needs to get better if they’re going to win in January.
A couple of big games for the offense against Chicago and NY over the next 2 weeks laid some of that talk to the rest but the production of the passing game, and the struggle to throw passing TDs, reared it's head again in the last two games against GB and Seattle.

The Vikings might have the NFL's best-kept secret QB problem. It's hiding in plain sight.
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

One guy I'm really starting to develop a man crush on is safety Miles Killebrew out of Southern Utah. This kid is at the top of every category at the combine for safeties and hits like a damn truck. He would be a great compliment next to Harrison Smith. There is a very good chance he's plugged into my next mock
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by VikingLord »

Pondering Her Percy wrote:One guy I'm really starting to develop a man crush on is safety Miles Killebrew out of Southern Utah. This kid is at the top of every category at the combine for safeties and hits like a damn truck. He would be a great compliment next to Harrison Smith. There is a very good chance he's plugged into my next mock
I agree on Killebrew. Not sure if he lasts until the 2nd round pick, but he would look fantastic next to Smith. I actually like his ability to read and react more than his hitting ability.

In fact, Cravens in the 1st followed by Killebrew in the 2nd would be great value. Would do nothing for the Vikes on offense, but great value at those two picks (assuming they view Cravens as a LB and not a safety).
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by S197 »

I've seen Cravens to the Vikings in a few mocks but the thing is, how often do we have 3 LB's on the field? It would be tough to utilize all 3 in a nickel defense. #23 seems like a tough spot this year with a lot of WR's and O-line going right before our pick. I think there's a good chance CW is there but I don't know that Rick will take a G/C in round 1, maybe if he can trade back later in the round.
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

VikingLord wrote: I agree on Killebrew. Not sure if he lasts until the 2nd round pick, but he would look fantastic next to Smith. I actually like his ability to read and react more than his hitting ability.

In fact, Cravens in the 1st followed by Killebrew in the 2nd would be great value. Would do nothing for the Vikes on offense, but great value at those two picks (assuming they view Cravens as a LB and not a safety).
I think Killebrew might be around longer than you think simply because of the small school. There are a few safeties projected to go ahead of him as well and none of them in the first round. I think we would have a shot at him in round 3.

Cravens and Killebrew are too similar IMO. Cravens is a hybrid SS/LB like Deone Buchanon. Killebrew is more of a safety but they are too similar in position for me to want to draft both. I like both players. Just not together
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

S197 wrote:I've seen Cravens to the Vikings in a few mocks but the thing is, how often do we have 3 LB's on the field? It would be tough to utilize all 3 in a nickel defense. #23 seems like a tough spot this year with a lot of WR's and O-line going right before our pick. I think there's a good chance CW is there but I don't know that Rick will take a G/C in round 1, maybe if he can trade back later in the round.
The reason I was so intrigued by Cravens is because he is a hybrid SS/LB that can kind of fill both spots in a way based on the situation at hand. I personally don't want a LB right off the bat. We got two very good ones the past two years. No need to invest another pick there. You can get anyone to fill an WLB role. If we could get a hybrid type player which is currently trending in the NFL like Cravens, that would be awesome. But we could sign a guy like Vincent Rey from Cincy to fill a regular WLB role like that if needed. No need to spend a high pick on one unless they have a lot of versatility.

If guys like Doctson, Whitehair, and Decker are still on the board at 23, I would be trading down in a heartbeat. If Treadwell is there at 23 he's a must-pick IMO. But if any of those three listed are all there, trading down would be the smart thing to do.
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by S197 »

Might be a reason why we go defense, at least in one scouts opinion.
"This is one of the worst drafts for offensive talent in the past four or five years," the scout said.

One thing that factors into this belief: Wide receivers ran the slowest 40-yard dash times since 2011. Speed certainly isn't everything, but it has become a large part of football.

Another factor: I've heard repeatedly from team officials that they think the best player in the draft is Ohio State running back Ezekiel Elliott—not any quarterback, not Ole Miss offensive lineman Laremy Tunsil, not any receiver. Running backs are not supposed to be the most captivating prospects for a passing league, but here we are.
The scout: "This is one of the deepest defensive drafts, I'd say, in about three years. Maybe longer. The thing that's impressed me is the quickness of the interior linemen. They also use some of the best technique that I've seen in some years."
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2620 ... =editorial
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by dead_poet »

S197 wrote:Might be a reason why we go defense, at least in one scouts opinion.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2620 ... =editorial
It wouldn't shock me if we went D-line in one of the first two rounds. Billings, for one, would be hard to pass up if he lasted that long.
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

dead_poet wrote: It wouldn't shock me if we went D-line in one of the first two rounds. Billings, for one, would be hard to pass up if he lasted that long.
I love Billings but he isn't going to win us a Super Bowl. It would be nice to have him when Joseph goes but analysts have said recently and I agree..... we are a playoff team that needs to fill a few holes. We aren't a team with 8 holes and we can go BPA. Technically we could do that of course but I feel it would be in our best interest to go WR or OL. I would probably be pretty upset if we didnt. If we took Billings, I love the guy but its a guy thats going to just sit and wait. We have the talent to go far NOW so lets fill those holes and go where we need to go
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by Jordysghost »

Pondering Her Percy wrote: I love Billings but he isn't going to win us a Super Bowl. It would be nice to have him when Joseph goes but analysts have said recently and I agree..... we are a playoff team that needs to fill a few holes. We aren't a team with 8 holes and we can go BPA. Technically we could do that of course but I feel it would be in our best interest to go WR or OL. I would probably be pretty upset if we didnt. If we took Billings, I love the guy but its a guy thats going to just sit and wait. We have the talent to go far NOW so lets fill those holes and go where we need to go
Drafting for perceived need this early in your teams lifecycle would be a risky move.
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by fiestavike »

Jordysghost wrote: Drafting for perceived need this early in your teams lifecycle would be a risky move.
I agree. I hate that its not looking like there will be a reasonable OL player to take at 23, but that's the way it goes. Hopefully Mr. Spielman will manage to address needs with a couple 2nd contract FAs and a couple low cost older FAs before heading into the draft.

S, OL, OL, WR.
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

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Round 1 Pick 28 (K.C.): Ezekiel Elliott, RB, Ohio State (A+)
Round 2 Pick 10 (CHI): Vernon Butler, DT, Louisiana Tech (A)
Round 2 Pick 23: Emmanuel Ogbah, DE, Oklahoma State (A+)
Round 3 Pick 7 (BALT): Jason Spriggs, OT, Indiana (A+)
Round 3 Pick 15 (N.O.): Landon Turner, OG, North Carolina (A)
Round 3 Pick 29 (N.E.): Sebastian Tretola, OG, Arkansas (A)
Round 4 Pick 6 (BALT): Karl Joseph, SS, West Virginia (B+)
Round 4 Pick 11 (NYG): Sterling Shepard, WR, Oklahoma (A+)
Round 5 Pick 21: Roger Lewis, WR, Bowling Green (A+)
Round 5 Pick 25 (G.B.): Paul Perkins, RB, UCLA (A+)
Round 6 Pick 5: Tom Hackett, P, Utah (A+)
Round 6 Pick 28 (K.C.): Thomas Duarte, WR, UCLA (A+)
Round 7 Pick 19: Daryl Worley, CB, West Virginia (B-)

gave up an additional Ist in 2018 to get this
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by Mothman »

Jordysghost wrote:Drafting for perceived need this early in your teams lifecycle would be a risky move.
Desperately reaching for perceived need is always risky but the Vikes are at the point in their "life cycle" where they must address needs and build logically if theyw ant to take the next step. I think the riskier move would be continuing to neglect areas in obvious need of improvement. they aren't that early in their development cycle anyway. They're entering Spielman's 5th year as GM (he's been calling the draft shots longer than that) and Zimmer's 3rd season as head coach. As far as I'm concerned, they're through developmental "puberty" and high school, almost done with college and they need to start thinking about employment or grad school. ;)

fiestavike wrote:I agree. I hate that its not looking like there will be a reasonable OL player to take at 23, but that's the way it goes.
I think it just depends on how the picks go. There are certainly OL players in this draft worthy of being selected at that spot.
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by fiestavike »

jackal wrote:Round 1 Pick 28 (K.C.): Ezekiel Elliott, RB, Ohio State (A+)
Round 2 Pick 10 (CHI): Vernon Butler, DT, Louisiana Tech (A)
Round 2 Pick 23: Emmanuel Ogbah, DE, Oklahoma State (A+)
Round 3 Pick 7 (BALT): Jason Spriggs, OT, Indiana (A+)
Round 3 Pick 15 (N.O.): Landon Turner, OG, North Carolina (A)
Round 3 Pick 29 (N.E.): Sebastian Tretola, OG, Arkansas (A)
Round 4 Pick 6 (BALT): Karl Joseph, SS, West Virginia (B+)
Round 4 Pick 11 (NYG): Sterling Shepard, WR, Oklahoma (A+)
Round 5 Pick 21: Roger Lewis, WR, Bowling Green (A+)
Round 5 Pick 25 (G.B.): Paul Perkins, RB, UCLA (A+)
Round 6 Pick 5: Tom Hackett, P, Utah (A+)
Round 6 Pick 28 (K.C.): Thomas Duarte, WR, UCLA (A+)
Round 7 Pick 19: Daryl Worley, CB, West Virginia (B-)

gave up an additional Ist in 2018 to get this
I'm not sure there would be room on the roster and the practice squad for all those guys!!!!
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Re: PHP's "Way Too Early But I Love It" 2016 Mock Offseason

Post by jackal »

Its called competition my friend .

Five or six of them would be locks

One of them might ride out time on
Injured reserve.
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