Vikings' Christian Ponder open to trade, but maximizing time

[Reignman]

At this point, it appears Ponder will make the final roster and serve as an insurance policy against an injury. Those who don’t like that idea probably would feel differently if Cassel was injured in the first quarter at St. Louis and the Vikings had to play ¾ of that game with just Bridgewater and the next 15 with Bridgewater and some young street free agent who hasn’t been practicing Turner’s offense since March.

So our choice is between Ponder and some young street free agent? After seeing what Ponder can/can't do the past few years, I don't think rolling the dice on a FA is all that much of a gamble haha. As long as it's not Freeman. Trade bait was a bit better tonight, but man he sure made even the easiest passes difficult for receivers to get YAC due to poor ball placement. Receivers were always falling down or contorting themselves to make catches.

[Mothman]

http://blog.startribune.com/sports/acce ... erformance

It took less than 20 seconds for Vikings head coach Mike Zimmer to bring up Christian Ponder in his post-game press conference after tonight’s 19-3 win over the Titans in the preseason finale, and he again staunchly defended the third-string quarterback.

“I’m especially proud of Christian Ponder because I know there’s been a lot of fans and a lot of people that have really been negative towards him,” Zimmer said. “And the guy’s been nothing but a first-class guy, works hard every single day and went on to perform well tonight.”

Ponder replaced starter Teddy Bridgewater at the 9:26 mark of the second quarter. He completed 12 of his 15 attempts for 121 yards with no touchdowns and no turnovers. He led the offense on three scoring drives and would have gotten them in the end zone if not for a drop at the goal line.

“I feel like I played well,” Ponder said. “There are some plays I’d like back. But overall, I’m pretty proud of the way I played and the way we all played.”

[Cliff]

Such a sad story for Ponder. Every year up until now he's been playing the starter role (besides his rookie year) and now he's happy with a 121 yard performance against 3rd stringers in the final game of the preseason.

The guy seems to be a genuinely good human being but a below average NFL quarterback. Gotta be difficult for him to accept this drastic dropoff if he's a competitor at all. If he's simply a business man, though, he's making some nice money for sitting on a bench with very little chance he ever takes an NFL hit again!

Even at 3rd sting he's playing at the highest level of his craft and being paid well for it. How many of us can say the same?

[Raptorman]

Granted, Ponder may not be the QB of the future in MN or anywhere. Yes, he has had some problems, but are they all on him or a bad OC? How bad Ponder was through the first half of last year when he was the only QB playing. And I know some of you are going to jump on me for this. It's easy to blame bad QB play when your team is not winning.

115/179 64.2% 1246 yards 5 TD's and 7 INt. Don't look good at all does it? Out of the 7 int the other teams picked up 17 points. During these games, the Vikings offense scored and average of 28.2 points per game. So you look at the line and see the 7 int's the lack of TD and say he sucked. So how did they score 28 points per game? Apparently the QB had nothing to do with those 28 ppg. Teams that score 28 ppg are usually 11-5 to 13-3. But when your defense is giving up an average of 32 ppg it's damn hard to win. Which is what was going on with Ponder in the game. But it's all on the sucky QB play of Ponder. Everyone looks at the bad throws, the throws he can't make, the poorly timed interceptions. And I get all that. But if he was so bad, how is it that they scored that many points per game during that time period? And just to put it into perspective, When Cassel was playing the offense scored and average of 24.2 ppg, while the defense gave up 27.9 ppg.

Don't get me wrong here, I don't think Ponder will be here next year. But I don't see the value in cutting him either. As a back up QB and leader on the field when he is on it, I think he better than most back ups.

[Funkytown]

The Pats got a 6th for Mallett. Ponder is worth more than that...right?

[Mothman]

The Pats got a 6th for Mallett. Ponder is worth more than that...right?

Are you really asking or is that twisted emoticon indicating pure sarcasm?

Good post, Raptorman. Regarding the number of points they scored in the first half of the season: Ponder's 4 rushing TDs are easily overlooked but getting the ball into the endzone on the ground is still an effective play by the QB.

I think Zimmer's take on Ponder thus far has beee pretty accurate. there was more from Zim in Sid Hartman's column today:

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikin ... 36911.html

Zimmer said he really liked the way that former starting quarterback Christian Ponder responded in Thursday’s preseason finale after not playing in the second and third games. Ponder went 12-for-15 for 121 yards for a 100.3 quarterback rating in the 19-3 victory at Tennessee.

“He was very good,” Zimmer said. “He did a nice job taking care of the ball, making the checks that we wanted him to make, and he did a nice job throwing the ball. I was impressed with him.”

Zimmer said he would keep Ponder on the roster and that there’s no question that the 2011 first-round draft pick can play in this league.

“I think [offensive coordinator] Norv [Turner] and [quarterbacks coach] Scott [Turner] have helped him quite a bit,” he said. “I think he’s going to continue to get better. He has a good enough arm, he’s a good enough athlete, and I think the more he feels comfortable in the pocket the better he is.”

Ponder can be successful in the NFL if he can cut down on turnovers and learn to stay comfortable in the pocket.

[Funkytown]

Are you really asking or is that twisted emoticon indicating pure sarcasm?

Have a little more faith. I was really asking.

To me, Ponder has to be worth more. Maybe not by much, but he's certainly shown more than Mallett.

[Mothman]

Have a little more faith. I was really asking.

I just wasn't sure how to interpret your statement since you put that particular emoticon with it. It can imply sarcasm.

To me, Ponder has to be worth more. Maybe not by much, but he's certainly shown more than Mallett.

I agree. I definitely think he's worth more than a 6th round pick.

[Raptorman]

Are you really asking or is that twisted emoticon indicating pure sarcasm?

Good post, Raptorman. Regarding the number of points they scored in the first half of the season: Ponder's 4 rushing TDs are easily overlooked but getting the ball into the endzone on the ground is still an effective play by the QB.

I think Zimmer's take on Ponder thus far has beee pretty accurate. there was more from Zim in Sid Hartman's column today:

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikin ... 36911.html
Ponder can be successful in the NFL if he can cut down on turnovers and learn to stay comfortable in the pocket.

The QB's job is to get his team downfield and score. On that position, no one can say that through the first half of last year Ponder did not do that. 28.2 ppg is damn high. How high is it? Only 61 teams out of 1,386 have had a higher scoring offense since 1970. Last year with Rodgers playing the Packers averaged 30.6 ppg.

In my mind he did what he was asked to do. Bring the team down and get them to score. That is the one stat no one is looking at. Know how many teams scored more than 28.2 ppg last year? One. The Broncos. So for the first half of the year the kid did a good job. Stat lines be damned.

[DK Sweets]

Have a little more faith. I was really asking.

To me, Ponder has to be worth more. Maybe not by much, but he's certainly shown more than Mallett.

Mallet went to a coach who had worked with him in the past, and his arm has a lot more potential than Ponder's. I'm not so sure I agree that Ponder is worth more, but I'm certain he isn't worth more to the Texans.

(I realize you weren't saying "to the Texans" but my overall point is that each situation has to stand on it's own; the Texans probably had a slightly inflated value of Mallet and nobody likely has an inflated value of Ponder.)

[Funkytown]

Update:

ESPN - Draft pick headed to Patriots in Ryan Mallett deal is conditional 7th-rd pick in 2016, source tells ESPN

I hope Ponder would be worth more than Mallett...regardless of team. If not, then that's ridiculous.

[Demi]

How is a guy who's a proven failure after over 30 starts worth more than anyone who is an acquisition based on potential? Ponder isn't worth anything. Or he would have been traded by now.

But "he" put up 28.2 ppg so stats be damned. Just look at the lip service from the head coach not giving him snaps in half the preseason games, and even in PRACTICES. But he did what they asked in the more meaningless of the meaningless preseason games. (Which, if you actually watched him, he still stares down receivers, has happy feet, and incredibly inconsistent accuracy. But if that's what Zimmer was asking for, mission accomplished! Anyone have an aircraft carrier and a giant banner? Maybe that'd help Zimmer and company drive up his value enough that another team would give *anything* for him)

[Raptorman]

How is a guy who's a proven failure after over 30 starts worth more than anyone who is an acquisition based on potential? Ponder isn't worth anything. Or he would have been traded by now.

But "he" put up 28.2 ppg so stats be damned. Just look at the lip service from the head coach not giving him snaps in half the preseason games, and even in PRACTICES. But he did what they asked in the more meaningless of the meaningless preseason games. (Which, if you actually watched him, he still stares down receivers, has happy feet, and incredibly inconsistent accuracy. But if that's what Zimmer was asking for, mission accomplished! Anyone have an aircraft carrier and a giant banner? Maybe that'd help Zimmer and company drive up his value enough that another team would give *anything* for him)

Not saying stats be damned. But people want to know why he is still on the team. So how do explain a team putting up 28 ppg if the QB is so bad? Why did that not go up but down, when Cassel started playing? Fact of the matter is every year that Ponder has played, when he was the QB, the team scored more ppg than other QB's. How do you account for that? Has he played that bad, sure. But it really goes to show you how bad the QB situation really was. That not one QB brought in could help the team average more ppg. The following includes the games were the QB were responsible for the majority of snaps. ie: Seattle last year went to Ponder not Cassel. The scary thought here is that as bad as he was, Ponder was probably the best option.

Code: Select all

2011	
Ponder	21.6 ppg
McNabb	20.2 ppg
	
2012	
Ponder	23.1 ppc
	
2013	
Ponder     26.0 ppg 
Cassel     24.0 ppg
Freeman    7.0 ppg

Addressing the failure issue. Last year while the offense was putting up 26 ppg with Ponder at the helm, the defense was giving up 32.6 ppg. Granted, some of those points were on Ponder(27 total) due to int and fumbles. But what of the games were they were not on him? BTW, Last year Aaron Rodgers averaged 30.5 ppg in the 9 games he played. The Packers went 6-3 in those games.

I know a lot of people don't like Ponder. I just don't think he is a bad as everyone makes him out to be. But that's just me. He will be gone next year and we won't have to talk about him anymore.

[Mothman]

Addressing the failure issue. Last year while the offense was putting up 26 ppg with Ponder at the helm, the defense was giving up 32.6 ppg. Granted, some of those points were on Ponder(27 total) due to int and fumbles. But what of the games were they were not on him? BTW, Last year Aaron Rodgers averaged 30.5 ppg in the 9 games he played. The Packers went 6-3 in those games.

I know a lot of people don't like Ponder. I just don't think he is a bad as everyone makes him out to be. But that's just me. He will be gone next year and we won't have to talk about him anymore.

I'm with you.

Ponder's young. He's played well at times. In his only full season as a starter, the team went to the playoffs. He has the physical tools to do the job. I think a coach with confidence in his ability to work with QBs would still look at him as a player who can make progress, get better and help a team. A 26 year old QB hasn't necessarily peaked in his development so "proven failure" is a relative, and debatable, term. Ponder failed as a high draft pick asked to establish himself as the Vikings long term answer at QB over the last 3 years. That doesn't mean he has no value or can't improve.

Many QBs learn to take better care of the ball as they get older and as you pointed out, the offense was fairly productive with Ponder at QB. The idea that a QB who can start 16 games for a playoff team is a complete, worthless failure at 26 just doesn't hold water. It will be interesting to see where his career goes from here.

[Raptorman]

I would like to point out one more thing. Of teams that give up 27.3 to 27.8 ppg on defense the average win percentage is .232. In games were Ponder was the main QB responsible the defense averaged 27.6 ppg given up. In those games the Vikings were .391.