Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

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Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Yes
44
44%
No
56
56%
 
Total votes: 100

dead_poet
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by dead_poet »

King James wrote:Give me your opinions on this clip.
Obviously not his best game. Probably the worst of his college career. It should be noted that this was being played during a windy/rainy day and LSU ran for over 300 yards. That said...

- He was plagued by a lot of drops. Especially early. (:14, 2:13, 5:46 -- would've been a TD)
- Credit LSU's defense, particularly in the second half when they were up big and knew Manziel would be throwing often. They could pin their ears back and come at him. They lived in the backfield. And they forced A&M in to a LOT of third-and-long situations.
- When they got down, he tried to do too much. He pressed. Looks like the ball slipped out of his hands a couple of times.
- He overthrew some receivers in this one, which he doesn't do that often.
- When he had time, his mechanics looked pretty solid to me. Still a bit flat-footed at times but overall pretty solid, especially the first quarter.

- :35 -- Gotta like seeing him go through his progressions and end up on his second or third read, delivering a strike for a first down.
- 1:30 -- This is great placement. Evans just didn't get his foot in. Aaron Rodgers earns a lot of money on these throws.
- 1:53 -- Good job at avoiding the initial pressure. I would've like to have seen him keep his eyes down field on this one.
- 4:10 -- Great job staying in the pocket. Perfect placement for the first down.
- 5:25 -- Bad snap that threw off timing, but he should've still completed this one.
- 8:22 -- Miscommunication between Manziel & Evans leading to a pick
- 12:28 -- Looked like the receiver was held here.
- 12:50 -- Just bad recognition & throw

- Only plays where you might think he "threw passes up for grabs:"
:25 -- Under pressure and passes to the only place where his receiver could've had a chance (and almost came down with it despite possibly being held)
5:00 -- Under pressure and passes off-balance to receiver front/outside shoulder (completion). Was not in danger of being picked off with placement.
5:58 -- Low snap, immediate pressure, 4th down play (would've been dumb to take a sack there).
7:00 -- Immediate pressure, scrambles, somehow sets his feet and delivers a strike (completion, but short of first down)
12:10 -- Had a man open. This isn't a "throw pass up for grabs" play
And I know ONE game doesn't make him the worst player ever but his footwork and decision making draws some concerns for me.
Thought his decision-making was OK in this one. Hard to tell for certain on some of the plays he took off without being able to see the secondary. From the commentary on some of them, they said they were all covered.
I think this is how things will translate for him in the NFL.
Because of one game. OK.
Most of these throws did not look like NFL quality throws.
What is your definition of an "NFL quality throw"?
He often threw passes up for grasp when pressured
If you define "often" as possibly 4 of 41 passes (0.0975%), then sure.
Put Manziel under pressure and he's a different person.
So are all QBs. Generally-speaking, Manziel is above-average when under pressure. in 2012, Manziel completed 51.4 percent of his passes when under duress, about 11 percentage points higher than the FBS average. I can't find the stats for 2013.

This was telling for those who question his pocket passing.
Improved pocket passing
Manziel completed 73 percent of his passes from inside of the pocket this season, best among quarterbacks from BCS automatic-qualifier conferences (AQ conferences) and up four percentage points from last season.

He completed at least 65 percent of his passes from inside of the pocket in every game but one this season.
http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/ ... fl-profile

Additionally...
Manziel completed 48 percent of his passes thrown 25 yards or longer this season, up nine percentage points from last season and in the top 10 among AQ quarterbacks.

Manziel had at least one such completion in every game he started this season.

In terms of comparisons to recent draft picks, among first-round picks in 2011 and 2012, only Robert Griffin III had a higher completion percentage on passes of 25 yards or longer than Manziel in his final year of college. Griffin’s was a hair better -- 52 percent.
Manziel has also excelled at moving the chains with both his arm and his feet. Since the start of last season, he has the highest total QBR on third down, and only Jordan Lynch has rushed for more yards on third down than Manziel.

Manziel’s 97.0 Total QBR and 53 percent first-down conversion rate in third-down situations leads the nation.
Manziel led the nation in opponent-adjusted QBR in 2012 (he finished third in 2013), and rates third-best over the last two seasons combined. That stat would be indicative of a reasonable chance of being an NFL starter. The three quarterbacks who finished No. 1 from 2009 to 2011 are among the NFL's best-- Colin Kaepernick, Andrew Luck and Russell Wilson.
http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/ ... fl-profile
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Purple bruise
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by Purple bruise »

King James wrote:I also want you guys to take a look at this game. I will provide more film from his games I have concerns about in the future. This game one of the most notable games from last season because Texas A&M got their #### beat like a government mule.



Give me your opinions on this clip. And I know ONE game doesn't make him the worst player ever but his footwork and decision making draws some concerns for me. I think this is how things will translate for him in the NFL. Most of these throws did not look like NFL quality throws. He often threw passes up for grasp when pressured, who does that remind us of?????? Joe Webb vs Green Bay wildcard game!!!!!! Put Manziel under pressure and he's a different person.
Give me your opinion on this guy, the Heisman trophy winner JFB with one of the worst defenses in the country.. Oh wait you already have numerous times. Seems as though you are the self appointed basher of JFB, you know the QB that was seriously injured numerous times during his college career. :roll: Here are his stats against your beloved team: Manziel was his spectacular self, throwing for a career-best 464 yards, running for 98 and throwing five TDs. His 562 total yards is the second-most in Southeastern Conference history, ranking only behind the 576 he had against Louisiana Tech.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/footba ... z2wcgkM5C4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LAUgtNtoDE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJ8xVIgWEBY
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VikingLord
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by VikingLord »

KSViking wrote:Ode to Dr Suess

Do not Draft Johnny Football
Do not draft him, let him Fall
Go pick a backer with some speed
or another star, a position of Need
Do not draft this Mr Manziel
else 4 more years of Purple Hell
Please Please Slicky Rick
Do not draft this cocky Pr!$(
Wow, most convincing argument I've seen on here against drafting Manziel...

:roll:

Yeah, we don't want a *cocky* QB for sure. The last thing the Vikes need is a QB who is going to, I don't know, yell at guys when they're not doing what they're supposed to, or try to fit a ball in and give his receiver a chance to make a play. Let's stick with guys who are nice and polite and spend their time after losses talking about how the "team" has to fix this and address that.

Manziel may fail as a pro, but it sure as heck won't be because of his attitude.
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VikingLord
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by VikingLord »

King James wrote: Give me your opinions on this clip. And I know ONE game doesn't make him the worst player ever but his footwork and decision making draws some concerns for me. I think this is how things will translate for him in the NFL. Most of these throws did not look like NFL quality throws. He often threw passes up for grasp when pressured, who does that remind us of?????? Joe Webb vs Green Bay wildcard game!!!!!! Put Manziel under pressure and he's a different person.
For every single game focusing on Manziel like the one you posted above, McCarron will have 3 similar games, and most of those will not be under any sort of duress like Manziel was under in the game against LSU.
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by King James »

Purple bruise wrote: Give me your opinion on this guy, the Heisman trophy winner JFB with one of the worst defenses in the country.. Oh wait you already have numerous times. Seems as though you are the self appointed basher of JFB, you know the QB that was seriously injured numerous times during his college career. :roll: Here are his stats against your beloved team: Manziel was his spectacular self, throwing for a career-best 464 yards, running for 98 and throwing five TDs. His 562 total yards is the second-most in Southeastern Conference history, ranking only behind the 576 he had against Louisiana Tech.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/footba ... z2wcgkM5C4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LAUgtNtoDE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJ8xVIgWEBY

Reading comprehension must not be your strong suit because what you posted has nothing to do with the clip. But Whatever. :roll:
King James
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by King James »

VikingLord wrote: For every single game focusing on Manziel like the one you posted above, McCarron will have 3 similar games, and most of those will not be under any sort of duress like Manziel was under in the game against LSU.

And you know this how? Quite funny considering that Bama has never got their butts kicked like this. And McCarron has owned LSU the past couple of games. Most notably that national championship game.
Purple bruise
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by Purple bruise »

King James wrote:
Reading comprehension must not be your strong suit because what you posted has nothing to do with the clip. But Whatever. :roll:
WTF, back to reading comprehension comments again :wallbang: You cherry picked the worst game of JFB career and post it. What is my opinion about that particular game? Well, it was not good but look at the rest of his games. I would be very carefull about dogging anyone on this board about reading comprehension. Go back and read your posts. They are filled with misspelled words, poor grammar, run-on sentences, pretty poor but this is a message board so let's not be so picky :yawn:
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lyzarde
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by lyzarde »

Personally I think he's gonna be a colossal failure. Even his good film I see nothing but fluttery passes and leaving the pocket early. The way he holds the ball is very Vick like so he'll probably have a fumbling problem too.

I really don't even care if he ends up being a great QB for someone. I don't like his face. I don't want to have to look at it all the time. Dude looks like the kid from the Tom Hanks movie Big but instead of getting big he only got to junior year of high school.

That's as good enough reason as anybody else has at this point.
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by King James »

What does reading comprehension have to do with spelling and grammar? :confused: Anyways that's not the point. I question your comprehension level because you OFTEN pick pieces of my post that you only to read. Which causes the misinterpretation of the points I'm trying to make.

You called me a JFB basher, all because I think he's not going to pan out in the NFL. I'm sure some people here don't think McCarron will be anything in the NFL, but I don't label them as bashers. That's their prediction.
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by King James »



Another bad game for "Little Johnny." This is the full game against Missouri. Just another reason why I don't believe him. Same dance, pressured him and had him contained. I think it's also good to mention that Manziel lost to all ranked teams they played last year except Duke, which they just did escape with a win.

Most of the teams they played weren't even ranked but when they play real teams, they couldn't win. But Manziel is a franchise player. :lol: Yeah right.
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by kurtkeoki »

My girlfriend knows nothing about football, but every year on the day of the draft there is one player I tell her I don't want the Vikings to pick, and to be prepared for a temper-tantrum and possibly damaged furniture. One year it was Percy Harvin, another it was Tebow. This year it's Manziel. I just wouldn't enjoy cheering for this enormous dbag. I plugged my nose and cheered for Favre because he was so great, but I really want Manziel to be a failure, and not for us.

Personal feelings about him aside, I'm actually not a huge fan of running QBs. Sure, there have been some good ones lately with Kapp and Wilson, but look at the long term track record of running QBs. Vick was injured a fair amount and never came close to realizing his potential as a passer. McNabb was great but injuries forced him to switch his style away from running a lot. RG3 may never be the same. Despite the trend toward running QBs, the majority of QBs that have been successful in the nfl over the last 5 years have been big, strong armed, pocket qbs. That's what I hope the Vikings are looking for.

And did I mention that Manziel is an enormous dbag?
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by frosted »

kurtkeoki wrote:My girlfriend knows nothing about football, but every year on the day of the draft there is one player I tell her I don't want the Vikings to pick, and to be prepared for a temper-tantrum and possibly damaged furniture. One year it was Percy Harvin, another it was Tebow. This year it's Manziel. I just wouldn't enjoy cheering for this enormous dbag. I plugged my nose and cheered for Favre because he was so great, but I really want Manziel to be a failure, and not for us.

Personal feelings about him aside, I'm actually not a huge fan of running QBs. Sure, there have been some good ones lately with Kapp and Wilson, but look at the long term track record of running QBs. Vick was injured a fair amount and never came close to realizing his potential as a passer. McNabb was great but injuries forced him to switch his style away from running a lot. RG3 may never be the same. Despite the trend toward running QBs, the majority of QBs that have been successful in the nfl over the last 5 years have been big, strong armed, pocket qbs. That's what I hope the Vikings are looking for.

And did I mention that Manziel is an enormous dbag?
That's cool, but how do you know this?
NextQuestion
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by NextQuestion »

He totally comes off as a total jock-bro type who would probably be BFFs with Jay Cutler. However, I want to have a beer with him anyways.
Pull yr 84 jerseys out.
frosted
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by frosted »

NextQuestion wrote:He totally comes off as a total jock-bro type who would probably be BFFs with Jay Cutler. However, I want to have a beer with him anyways.
Maybe I'm one of those type of guys, and that's why it doesn't bother me..haha. Idk. College has been good to me.
NextQuestion
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Re: Do you want Johnny Manziel at #8?

Post by NextQuestion »

He just kind of seems like a kid that would leave a bag of his own feces in an old person's mailbox and quickly jump into his buddy's Jeep Wrangler, only to hot box a short time later in a McDonald's parking lot at 1:30 in the morning.
Pull yr 84 jerseys out.
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