2014 Vikings Draft Discussion

[losperros]

I would say all bets are off when it comes to QBs. It is entirely possible for all 5 to be gone when we pick at 8. None of the "experts" predicted a massive rush of OL like we saw last year either.

I honestly believe that getting the elite QB is as much luck as it is anything else. The best guy in this draft could just as likely get picked in the 5th round or the 1st round based on the info we the fans have via sources like ESPN. There is a reason Mel Kiper is on TV and not sitting in a GM's chair...

I agree. Nothing will surprise me. Not which QB gets picked first or when they get picked. Anything can happen and NFL draft scouts can change their minds at any time.

All draft picks are crap shoots. College ball, even with pro-style offenses and defenses, is not professional football. When it comes to college and NFL football, some players excel at one but not the other, which is why some college players might be the best athletes in the draft but end up washing out in the NFL.

[dead_poet]

Defense ranks:

Manziel:

Rice: 82nd
Sam Houston: 1-AA School
Alabama: 1st
SMU: 62nd
Arkansas: 73rd
Ole Miss: 46th
Auburn: 79th
Vandy: 19th
UTEP: 91st
Miss St: 52nd
LSU: 8th
Mizzou: 58th
Duke: 104th

Bridgewater:

Ohio: 55th
Eastern Kentucky: 1-AA school
Kentucky: 59th
FIU: 66th
Temple: 90th
Rutgers: 10th
UCF: 42nd
USF: 65th
UConn: 9th
Houston: 115th
Memphis: 50th
Cincinnati:54th
Miami: 116th

That's not a whole lot different.

Provided those are accurate (thanks for looking that up!) you're right. I think Manziel averaged a defense ranked #56, while Bridgewater faced a defense ranked #60. Are you making the argument that Bridgewater is > Manziel? I'm not sure you'd get much disagreement.

Plus Bridgewater lit up Florida in last years Bowl game.

That's not really comparing apples-to-apples by tossing in a team from last year. For the sake of argument, Manziel lit up #1 ranked Alabama last year as well. Manziel was the offensive MVP of that year's Cotton Bowl vs. the #12-ranked Oklahoma, passing for 287 yards and 2 TDs and rushing for 229 yards and two more scores.

[PsyDanny]

Blake Bortles - QB - Player

Draft Insider Tony Pauline writes that UCF QB Blake Bortles is a "clear-cut favorite" to be the Texans' pick at No. 1 overall.

Pauline believes Texans owner Bob McNair prefers Johnny Manziel, but Bortles is a "Bill O'Brien type of passer," and Houston seems likely to lock in on signal callers with the draft's top pick. Bortles has drawn media comparisons ranging from Jake Locker to Andrew Luck. In his latest mock draft, Pauline pencils in Bortles at No. 1, and Texas A&M LT Jake Matthews at No. 2 to St. Louis.
Source: TFY Draft Insider

One of those deals where they entice a team to trade up into their spot, then nab "their guy" later on?

[Pondering Her Percy]

Your boy Rickie would have to work some magic. But yeah, it would be a huge price. No one else really jumps out at me, other then Jimmy later on. Or maybe Zach if we have a few years to kill...

If there was an Andrew Luck type guy out there then yeah go ahead and do it but there is not. I just don't think it is worth it.

I feel that many teams have learned from 2011. Teams rushed to pick QBs and many of them ended up busting (Gabbert, Ponder, Locker). Then Cincy grabs Dalton in the 2nd and he's been the best of the bunch (outside of Newton obviously). In 2012, we all see how the RGIII situation is looking now and it unsure if Tannehill is the answer in Miami. When you look at last year....Barkley, Smith, and Nassib were all guaranteed top 10 and then just before the draft you started to see them fall. Some more rapidly than others. Then you had EJ Manuel come out of nowhere. This years 1st round QB talk is VERY similar to last years. You had all these guys rise up draft boards because of needy teams and they ended up disappearing when it all boiled down.

I truly believe that you will see more QB's fall this year than you think. There are a plethora of QB's that could end up being solid from the 2nd round on (Mettenberger, Boyd, Murray, Garappolo, McCarron, Fales, etc). Is a guy like Derek Carr or Blake Bortles going to be THAT much better than any of those "late" rounders I listed...Some? maybe. All of them? doubtful. I think teams realized that in 2011, they passed up on better players because they were so desperate. You have to be patient when making a decision like that. Cincinnati was patient and they end up pulling in AJ Green and Andy Dalton. I'm sure Spielman understands that as well since he was a victim in 2011. Hence, why I think he is going to be patient come this draft. Something is telling me the guy we want is going to end up falling right on our lap.

[Texas Vike]

Good post, Pondering. I think we will almost certainly be best served by drafting a defensive stud at 8 and then targeting a QB in the 2nd or 3rd, or possibly using our 2nd 3rd to climb back into the late first , as Spielman has shown he likes to do, to snag our QB ahead of other teams with similar intentions at the top of the 2nd.

[Pondering Her Percy]

Good post, Pondering. I think we will almost certainly be best served by drafting a defensive stud at 8 and then targeting a QB in the 2nd or 3rd, or possibly using our 2nd 3rd to climb back into the late first , as Spielman has shown he likes to do, to snag our QB ahead of other teams with similar intentions at the top of the 2nd.

Thanks! That was the same exact thing I was thinking. This is what I had us doing in my mock offseason that I recently posted. I could definitely see Spielman jumping back into the back-end of the 1st and get ahead of teams like Oakland, Jacksonville, Cleveland, etc.

[CbusVikesFan]

[quote="Pondering Her Percy]
If there was an Andrew Luck type guy out there then yeah go ahead and do it but there is not. I just don't think it is worth it.

I feel that many teams have learned from 2011. Teams rushed to pick QBs and many of them ended up busting (Gabbert, Ponder, Locker). Then Cincy grabs Dalton in the 2nd and he's been the best of the bunch (outside of Newton obviously). In 2012, we all see how the RGIII situation is looking now and it unsure if Tannehill is the answer in Miami. When you look at last year....Barkley, Smith, and Nassib were all guaranteed top 10 and then just before the draft you started to see them fall. Some more rapidly than others. Then you had EJ Manuel come out of nowhere. This years 1st round QB talk is VERY similar to last years. You had all these guys rise up draft boards because of needy teams and they ended up disappearing when it all boiled down.

I truly believe that you will see more QB's fall this year than you think. There are a plethora of QB's that could end up being solid from the 2nd round on (Mettenberger, Boyd, Murray, Garappolo, McCarron, Fales, etc). Is a guy like Derek Carr or Blake Bortles going to be THAT much better than any of those "late" rounders I listed...Some? maybe. All of them? doubtful. I think teams realized that in 2011, they passed up on better players because they were so desperate. You have to be patient when making a decision like that. Cincinnati was patient and they end up pulling in AJ Green and Andy Dalton. I'm sure Spielman understands that as well since he was a victim in 2011. Hence, why I think he is going to be patient come this draft. Something is telling me the guy we want is going to end up falling right on our lap.[/quote]

Great assessment. Could one of those guys fall to us in the later rounds? Two common denominators in the teams left in the postseason...good to great QB's and good to great defenses. Sure would be great to get back to those winning ways. Soon.

[PurpleKoolaid]

After watching my second favorite team, The seahawks, destroy one of my least favorite teams, the saints, if we don't get teddy, we better not draft a QB till late and work on our D. I know this means putting a qb off yet anther year, but we need to shore up this D with the first 2 picks. Trade down, get Nix, and then whatever the best CB is. Or go Mack and whatever CB is left.

[headless_norseman]

After watching my second favorite team, The seahawks, destroy one of my least favorite teams, the saints, if we don't get teddy, we better not draft a QB till late and work on our D. I know this means putting a qb off yet anther year, but we need to shore up this D with the first 2 picks. Trade down, get Nix, and then whatever the best CB is. Or go Mack and whatever CB is left.

Still can't understand this mentality. Work on the D when getting a QB is by far and away our major problem. And this has been the case for a few years now.

Look at Seattle today. Wilson had stats that made Ponder lok good, yet they won with good D and a running game.

[Funkytown]

Still can't understand this mentality. Work on the D when getting a QB is by far and away our major problem. And this has been the case for a few years now.

Look at Seattle today. Wilson had stats that made Ponder lok good, yet they won with good D and a running game.

Seems like you understand it perfectly.

[Pondering Her Percy]

The more I watch this Carolina/SF game, the more I want to draft defense with our 1st round pick. 3 years ago, Carolina was the worst team in the league and drafted Newton. Granted, Newton has been decent, but at the same time, they were pretty bad after that too. Newton couldn't help that team win for a while. Now this year, they have a legitimate defense and end up 12-4. I think many can agree that the big reason Carolina was so good this year was because of their defense. Not so much Newton or the offense.

I think we have enough pieces on offense and can wait until the 2-3 round to grab a QB. We have more weapons on offense than Carolina does (Better RB, WRs, TE) but just don't have the defense to back it up. We could really use a Keuchly/Willis/Bowman type guy on this defense. In this draft I think that type of guy would be Mack or Mosely. I truly believe that Mike Mauti could be that type of guy too. I think Zimmer is a coach that would make Mike Mauti just like he made Burfict. Whether it be Mack, Mosely, or Mauti, we need a leader in the middle of this defense. Not a guy that gets 2 DWI's in a month span

Our best options IMO (in this order):
1.) Khalil Mack
2.) CJ Mosely
3.) Give Mike Mauti his shot

[mondry]

They also completely re-did their DT situation drafting both Star Lotulelei and Kawaan Short 1st and 2nd round, back to back so it's not just the LB spot. I want a NT if it lines up for a top NT to be there at 8, we haven't had anyone decent since pat left and to me it seems like we have nothing in the depths brewing either. At least at LB we have Hodges, Mauti, and Cole who at minimum have some potential. If Zimmer gets in here he'll get those guys up to speed.

Should basically be defense, defense, QB, defense, defense, Murray, left offensive guard.

[Pondering Her Percy]

They also completely re-did their DT situation drafting both Star Lotulelei and Kawaan Short 1st and 2nd round, back to back so it's not just the LB spot. I want a NT if it lines up for a top NT to be there at 8, we haven't had anyone decent since pat left and to me it seems like we have nothing in the depths brewing either. At least at LB we have Hodges, Mauti, and Cole who at minimum have some potential. If Zimmer gets in here he'll get those guys up to speed.

Should basically be defense, defense, QB, defense, defense, Murray, left offensive guard.

Yes NT would be ideal as well. The only one I would want in the 1st is Nix.

Also, I can't see Spielman drafting two QB's. We already have a somewhat decent QB in Cassel (guessing he won't opt-out). I think whoever they draft is going to be "their" guy. There are too many holes on this team to draft 2 QBs. We have to use these picks wisely which Spielman has done as of late. Who knows though, anything can happen

[VikingPaul73]

The more I watch this Carolina/SF game, the more I want to draft defense with our 1st round pick. 3 years ago, Carolina was the worst team in the league and drafted Newton. Granted, Newton has been decent, but at the same time, they were pretty bad after that too. Newton couldn't help that team win for a while. Now this year, they have a legitimate defense and end up 12-4. I think many can agree that the big reason Carolina was so good this year was because of their defense. Not so much Newton or the offense.

I think we have enough pieces on offense and can wait until the 2-3 round to grab a QB. We have more weapons on offense than Carolina does (Better RB, WRs, TE) but just don't have the defense to back it up. We could really use a Keuchly/Willis/Bowman type guy on this defense. In this draft I think that type of guy would be Mack or Mosely. I truly believe that Mike Mauti could be that type of guy too. I think Zimmer is a coach that would make Mike Mauti just like he made Burfict. Whether it be Mack, Mosely, or Mauti, we need a leader in the middle of this defense. Not a guy that gets 2 DWI's in a month span

Our best options IMO (in this order):
1.) Khalil Mack
2.) CJ Mosely
3.) Give Mike Mauti his shot

I agree. If there was a Luck type sitting there at #8 it would be a different story, but I think anyone remaining at #8 would be a reach. Look at the 4 NFC teams this weekend, Carolin, SF, and Seattle are here based on strong D not because of a high flying offense.

Build up the D, draft a QB to groom for a year, maybe in the 3rd. I want to see a return of the Purple People Eaters......couple that with a 2500 yard season from All Day and heck even Cassel could take us on a deep playoff run!

[Pondering Her Percy]

I agree. If there was a Luck type sitting there at #8 it would be a different story, but I think anyone remaining at #8 would be a reach. Look at the 4 NFC teams this weekend, Carolin, SF, and Seattle are here based on strong D not because of a high flying offense.

Build up the D, draft a QB to groom for a year, maybe in the 3rd. I want to see a return of the Purple People Eaters......couple that with a 2500 yard season from All Day and heck even Cassel could take us on a deep playoff run!