Vikings Message Board.Com

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... ut-ponder/

The thinking in league circles is that defenses have complied enough game film to crack the code on Ponder’s tendencies in the 2012 passing game. “Now that they’ve figured him out,” the source said, “it’s over.”

More at the link.

Big deal. I have Rodgers figured out. Get pressure on him and take away the long ball. Guess what, he sucks then. Trick is doing it. The Vikings have to make sure they make adjustments. That is on the coaches as well as the QB.

Raptorman wrote:Big deal. I have Rodgers figured out. Get pressure on him and take away the long ball. Guess what, he sucks then.

LOL! That reaction was priceless.

Trick is doing it. The Vikings have to make sure they make adjustments. That is on the coaches as well as the QB.

Agreed. The article at the link Dave posted basically says the same thing.

For what it's worth, I don't think it's just that defenses have "figured out" Ponder. They've figured out the Vikes passing game. Put eight men in the box, key on Harvin, apply pressure. Repeat.

There are some pretty obvious shortcomings in the offense.

I'd like to see someone else at LG, maybe I'm just hating but I really don't think CJ has been very good. Can Schwartz play LG, they might want to find out... Better offensive line play could help the offense overall.

Mothman wrote:For what it's worth, I don't think it's just that defenses have "figured out" Ponder. They've figured out the Vikes passing game. Put eight men in the box, key on Harvin, apply pressure. Repeat.

There are some pretty obvious shortcomings in the offense.

I agree. Opposing Ds know how to play against the entire Vikings pass offense. This team has its shortcomings and limitations, which means the coaches have to take what works and invent creative ways of implementing their best weapons (Harvin and Peterson).

mondry wrote:I'd like to see someone else at LG, maybe I'm just hating but I really don't think CJ has been very good. Can Schwartz play LG, they might want to find out... Better offensive line play could help the offense overall.

It could but the problems appear to be across the OL, not just Johnson. Loadholt still struggles against quick rushers on the outside. Kalil had a pretty rough game in pass protection against TB and Sullivan might have played his worst game of the season. The whole line needs to step it up.

Mothman wrote: It could but the problems appear to be across the OL, not just Johnson. Loadholt still struggles against quick rushers on the outside. Kalil had a pretty rough game in pass protection against TB and Sullivan might have played his worst game of the season. The whole line needs to step it up.

Well aside from Loadholt the common denominator between kalil and sullivans bad games is that they're both next to johnson who's missing his assignments, perhaps just a coincidence.

mondry wrote:Well aside from Loadholt the common denominator between kalil and sullivans bad games is that they're both next to johnson who's missing his assignments, perhaps just a coincidence.

It certainly wasn't because of Johnson against TB. They were just plain whipped on some plays. Johnson had his issues too but I don't think he should be a scapegoat for their mistakes.

The blitzes that hit home were more often than not coming through the interior gaps. Loadholt isn't top tier RT, but he has had a solid year. The guard play seems to be the issue. Either that or Sullivan is missing protection calls, which could also be part of the problem.

I do not know enough about protection to say what specifically is wrong, but I see what everyone else sees and it looks like the guards are not making good on their protection assignments.

mansquatch wrote:The blitzes that hit home were more often than not coming through the interior gaps. Loadholt isn't top tier RT, but he has had a solid year. The guard play seems to be the issue. Either that or Sullivan is missing protection calls, which could also be part of the problem.

That could definitely be part of the problem because it's not just the guard play, it's the line play. Against Tampa, a player at every position along the Vikes o-line allowed a rusher to either mow him down or run right past him. Kalil, Johnson, Sullivan, the RG (I forget if it was Fusco or Schwartz at the time) and Loadholt all did it, most of them more than once. Loadholt has had a solid year as a run blocker but he continues to let rushers get outside and around him. Sullivan had a pretty weak game against the Bucs. He missed blocks and he was beaten quite a few times. The same goes for Kalil. The line just wasn't good.

Mothman wrote: That could definitely be part of the problem because it's not just the guard play, it's the line play. Against Tampa, a player at every position along the Vikes o-line allowed a rusher to either mow him down or run right past him. Kalil, Johnson, Sullivan, the RG (I forget if it was Fusco or Schwartz at the time) and Loadholt all did it, most of them more than once. Loadholt has had a solid year as a run blocker but he continues to let rushers get outside and around him. Sullivan had a pretty weak game against the Bucs. He missed blocks and he was beaten quite a few times. The same goes for Kalil. The line just wasn't good.

I still think we should try Loadholt at Guard rather than Johnson. Yeah he's big, but so is Ponder. I don't think it would be as bad as some think as far as trying to get the ball out with him in the way or something.

PurpleMustReign wrote:I still think we should try Loadholt at Guard rather than Johnson. Yeah he's big, but so is Ponder. I don't think it would be as bad as some think as far as trying to get the ball out with him in the way or something.

Who would they put at RT?

Again, just a hunch, but I think the youth of the Vikings in combination with the very short week may have been a contributing factor to the bad protection by the OL and the bad gap control by the Defensive Front 7 against Tampa. That isn't an excuse per se, they need to be able to handle a short week, but it wouldn't surprise me if that was part of the problem last week. Given the roster it was inevitable that we'd see the downside of youth at some point.

Based on what we've seen over the past 8 games, it does not seem unreasonable to me to think these breakdowns up front will get fixed. Arizona did not have a bad defense and our OKL did well against them. The team has shown it can play better than what we saw last Thursday.

The bigger question IMO is how the WR and QB can improve. That is where we need to see the Vikings take a step.

mansquatch wrote:Again, just a hunch, but I think the youth of the Vikings in combination with the very short week may have been a contributing factor to the bad protection by the OL and the bad gap control by the Defensive Front 7 against Tampa. That isn't an excuse per se, they need to be able to handle a short week, but it wouldn't surprise me if that was part of the problem last week. Given the roster it was inevitable that we'd see the downside of youth at some point.

Based on what we've seen over the past 8 games, it does not seem unreasonable to me to think these breakdowns up front will get fixed. Arizona did not have a bad defense and our OKL did well against them. The team has shown it can play better than what we saw last Thursday.

The bigger question IMO is how the WR and QB can improve. That is where we need to see the Vikings take a step.

I thought the OL was awful against Arizona (in pass protection) so I think they need to take a step in all 3 areas. However, if the WRs and OL take a step forward, I suspect we'll see Ponder perform better right along with them.

I think you're probably right about youth and the short week having an impact on the pass protection against TB.

Glad they've only figured Ponder out and not the offense as a whole otherwise we'd have a huge problem.