Vikings Message Board.Com

Spielman will cop out, I guarantee it

Free agent receiver Greg Jennings brought his wife with him to the Minnesota Vikings' recruiting dinner Thursday night, according to Ben Goessling of the St. Paul Pioneer Press.

---

That's nice and all, but I still think it's a leverage ploy. The Vikings have a number, the Packers have a number. Jennings is going to have to decide between the two. All things equal, he'll be back in Green Bay a la James Jones last season.

dead_poet wrote: ---

That's nice and all, but I still think it's a leverage ploy. The Vikings have a number, the Packers have a number. Jennings is going to have to decide between the two. All things equal, he'll be back in Green Bay a la James Jones last season.

I think it's obvious that the Vikings will have to offer more than Green Bay ... but I don't think it'll have to be a rediculous amount more. They won't go overboard but I think they'll do it. They'll be able to get a good receiver and keep the extra draft pick and they've already freed up the cap space.

Been a Viking fan for 42 seasons. Regardless who the owner has been, this organization has never been a big spender. The Walker debacle aside, this team will lose the bidding war all the time. I believe Jennings will just use Minnesota to up the ante giving him more leverage with Green Bay for a bigger contract. He's 29 yrs old which means this will be the last chance for him to get the "Big Deal". I still find it hard to believe that a team which once had receivers like Gilliam, White, Rashad, A. Carter, C. Carter and Moss be sitting here with not one tier 1 or tier 2 receiver on the roster. The Ponder bashers need to back off. Eli Manning started to show consistancy in his third year. He also had Plaxico Burress and Amani Toomer and Shockey as receivers. Perhaps this team would be better suited if they released all Q.B.'s, receivers and T.E.'s. Line up 10 offensive lineman with Peterson in the backfield. Run him 700 times and maybe he'll get 3000 yds. What next? Bernard Berian?

dead_poet wrote: ---

That's nice and all, but I still think it's a leverage ploy. The Vikings have a number, the Packers have a number. Jennings is going to have to decide between the two. All things equal, he'll be back in Green Bay a la James Jones last season.

That's possible but it really depends on what Jennings wants. His role in Green Bay may be diminishing. Maybe he wants a bigger role or a new challenge and it won't take a substantially larger offer than what Green Bay has made to get him to sign.

My guess is that if he leaves Minnesota without a contract, he's not coming back to sign later.

Mothman wrote:His role in Green Bay may be diminishing.

It's possible, but I still think he's the starter opposite Nelson with Cobb in the slot. If healthy, he's still superior to James Jones (who, admittedly, stepped up last season). Even if he loses some reps to Jones, he's still on a pass-first team with a top-3 QB. If he wants to talk receiving numbers, TDs, legacy, etc. then I don't see how coming here would help his cause. Depending on the offer he received from GB and apparent lack of interest in signing him to a contract during the season, he might feel a bit jaded and unwanted. Of course, if the $10 million/year offer is true (and is still available) he'll likely look past all that.

Other than $$ I don't see what Minnesota could offer that would be more attractive (especially in terms of present facilities). Kind of hope I'm wrong and we sign him for $7-8 million/year. Not optimistic though.

dead_poet wrote: It's possible, but I still think he's the starter opposite Nelson with Cobb in the slot. If healthy, he's still superior to James Jones (who, admittedly, stepped up last season). Even if he loses some reps to Jones, he's still on a pass-first team with a top-3 QB. If he wants to talk receiving numbers, TDs, legacy, etc. then I don't see how coming here would help his cause. Depending on the offer he received from GB and apparent lack of interest in signing him to a contract during the season, he might feel a bit jaded and unwanted. Of course, if the $10 million/year offer is true (and is still available) he'll likely look past all that.

Other than $$ I don't see what Minnesota could offer that would be more attractive (especially in terms of present facilities).

In addition to money, I think the Vikes could offer more touches, different looks and an opportunity to play for a team on the rise. That's what I would be selling him on, along with the opportunity to clearly be the top WR on the depth chart. Having Peterson in the backfield could create opportunities for him that are different than what he'd see in GB.

The Vikes were competitive against GB and in the division last year. To me, that's a selling point too and they may argue that they're pointed in the right direction and the Packers are going in reverse. Whether that's true or not is debatable, of course, but since winning the Super Bowl in 2010, GB has allowed 45 points and 37 points in their last two playoff losses. I'd try to use that in my pitch and as you said, he may be feeling a bit jaded and unwanted. GB looks willing to phase him out. The Vikings need him. Maybe that will help them get a deal done.

I certainly understand your pessimism. It probably won't be an easy sell.

Jim

I agree with Jim. No matter how pass happy an offense is the number 3 wideout will not get as many passes as a number 1 wideout on a run first team assuming they have the same skill set. doing some dirty math Ponder averaged just over 30 attempts per game last season. Aaron Rodgers was at 34. You consider how many more targets Aaron has over Ponder and its safe to assume that Jennings would be targeted at least 5 fewer times per game. Now if he were to make all those catches (highly unlikely obviously) but still if he did that would be 60 more receptions a year in MN then in GB. If he comes to Minny he will be the number one guy for 3 years and will "preside" (not the word I would use ) over a core of young wideouts. So all things being the same money wise, in minnesota he gets;

More targets
Peterson in the Backfield
More "authority" if you will
He gets to be THE guy, if the chips are down the ball is coming to him. I have to think, deep down he would want that. Knowing that hell have a chance to make those career defining grabs without competing with the other wide outs has to be at least a small factor

Mothman wrote:In addition to money, I think the Vikes could offer more touches

Debatable. Does a #1 receiver in a run-first offense present more opportunities than a #1/2 receiver in a pass-first offense? Depending on his supporting cast, it COULD (a la Cutler/Marshall last season with Marshall being essentially Cutler's only target, especially when Alshon went down). It's more of a "spread the wealth" situation in GB with a much better QB. I suppose I'm still on the side that while Jennings' snaps might be at a 5-10% reduction in GB, he'd get more opportunities and likely catch more balls with a superior QB.

different looks

You're saying we might play him in the slot on occasion whereas Cobb has a lock on that in GB? I suppose, though I don't feel that's a very significant selling point (unless he REALLY loves the slot).

and an opportunity to play for a team on the rise.

It's hard to differentiate the Vikings from the Packers and make that strong of a case. The Pack have riding pretty high the last few years (and rightfully so as much as it pains me to say), so unless they continue to be in the Super Bowl, they are going to have a hard time getting much higher. The Vikings have...had room to grow.

the opportunity to clearly be the top WR on the depth chart. Having Peterson in the backfield could create opportunities for him that are different than what he'd see in GB.

I think he'd still be 1a or 1b in GB, but you're right that his status here would be 1a 1b and 1c (as it stands). The presence of AD might be a nice selling point though, I'll give you that. I wonder if he has routinely commanded regular double teams in GB.

I certainly understand your pessimism. It probably won't be an easy sell.

The fact that he put his house up a month or so ago leads me to believe he does feel unwanted and looking to move on. As always, numbers will be a large influencer. If they're close (or the Vikings offer is smaller), I expect him back in GB. If they are bigger, he should wind up in Purple. The question is, how MUCH more will it take? Don't think he and his agent aren't keenly aware of the Vikings' situation and won't look to squeeze them due to their perceived desperation and obvious need at the position.

Debatable. Does a #1 receiver in a run-first offense present more opportunities than a #1/2 receiver in a pass-first offense? Depending on his supporting cast, it COULD (a la Cutler/Marshall last season with Marshall being essentially Cutler's only target, especially when Alshon went down). It's more of a "spread the wealth" situation in GB with a much better QB. I suppose I'm still on the side that while Jennings' snaps might be at a 5-10% reduction in GB, he'd get more opportunities and likely catch more balls with a superior QB.






Aaron Rodgers only threw the ball 4 more times a game last year compared to Ponder. Remember they are all about balance over there so even though GB gets most of their yard through the air. Aaron isn't slinging it all over. Being the number one guy vs competing with 2-3 other highly skilled receivers for your touches makes it a near certainty that Jennings would get the ball more here.

dead_poet wrote: Debatable. Does a #1 receiver in a run-first offense present more opportunities than a #1/2 receiver in a pass-first offense? Depending on his supporting cast, it COULD (a la Cutler/Marshall last season with Marshall being essentially Cutler's only target, especially when Alshon went down). It's more of a "spread the wealth" situation in GB with a much better QB. I suppose I'm still on the side that while Jennings' snaps might be at a 5-10% reduction in GB, he'd get more opportunities and likely catch more balls with a superior QB.

It's debatable but the idea is they can offer it to him as a selling point and they can point to the number of catches Harvin had last year to reinforce their point. Whether he would actually get more touches is anybody's guess and impossible to determine unless he played for both the Vikes and Packers next season.

You're saying we might play him in the slot on occasion whereas Cobb has a lock on that in GB? I suppose, though I don't feel that's a very significant selling point (unless he REALLY loves the slot).

No, that wasn't what I meant. I meant he might face some different defensive looks in Minnesota, where opponents frequently bring extra defenders up in an effort to stop Peterson. A WR is arguably likely to see more frequent single high safety coverage against the Vikings than against any other team.

It's hard to differentiate the Vikings from the Packers and make that strong of a case. The Pack have riding pretty high the last few years (and rightfully so as much as it pains me to say), so unless they continue to be in the Super Bowl, they are going to have a hard time getting much higher. The Vikings have...had room to grow.

Nevertheless, they can make it part of their pitch, especially because GB hasn't been in the Super Bowl the last few years. They've been eliminated in the divisional round while giving up a lot of points to their opponents. Whether Jennings would buy the "team on the rise" angle as part of a pitch is up to him but the Vikes look like a team on the rise so they can certainly try to sell themselves that way.

The fact that he put his house up a month or so ago leads me to believe he does feel unwanted and looking to move on. As always, numbers will be a large influencer. If they're close (or the Vikings offer is smaller), I expect him back in GB. If they are bigger, he should wind up in Purple. The question is, how MUCH more will it take? Don't think he and his agent aren't keenly aware of the Vikings' situation and won't look to squeeze them due to their perceived desperation and obvious need at the position.

Oh, they will and they should and the Vikings are likely going to have to overpay Jennings to sign him. It's the unfortunate situation they find themselves in, although if he is signed and stays healthy, he could easily be worth a big contract. He's a superb route-runner with great hands and the ability to run pretty much every route on the tree. The Vikes need a guy like that and in their situation, they'll probably have to roll the dice and spend to get one.

Things are going well for the Vikings and Greg Jennings, but the Packers are still in the mix to re-sign him

John Clayton on Twitter

--
Not sure what that means, but OK, John. Thanks...?

dead_poet wrote: John Clayton on Twitter

--
Not sure what that means, but OK, John. Thanks...?

I guess they had a delicious dinner!

but the Packers are still in the mix to re-sign him

Seems that every single report over the last few days about Jennings and the Vikings has ended with this phrase.