Vikings Message Board.Com

Where do you drive a Carr? Over the bridge, duh.
Whats under the bridge? Water of course.
This is indisputable evidence that without out the Water there would be no Bridge and without the Carr there would be no need of either.
Logical conclusion. Bridgewater is better. sheeesh

Mothman wrote: Here are the numbers for this season, for those interested:

Carr:
316 attempts
203 completions (64.2%)
2396 yards
7.6 YPA
21 TDs
6 INT
10 sacks

Bridgewater:
254 attempts
163 completions (64.2%)
1810 yards
7.1 YPA
7 TDs
6 INT
24 sacks

Carr has 62 more attempts this year. Since they have the same completion percentage, let's simply assume Bridgewater would have the same number of completions as Carr if he had the same number of attempts. Bridgewater's passing stats with the same number of attempts project to:

316 attempts
203 completions (64.2%)
2244 yards
7.1 YPA
9 TDs
8-9 INTs
27 sacks

In other words, compared to Carr, he would have:

-152 yards
-12 TDs
+2-3 INTs
+17 sacks

Statistically, the advantage clearly still goes to Carr but, of course, stats aren't everything.

You left out a huge stat Jim, Vikes vs Raiders , Teddy 1-0 Carr 0-1 Just saying

Purple bruise wrote:You left out a huge stat Jim, Vikes vs Raiders , Teddy 1-0 Carr 0-1 Just saying

I hear you but that's a team stat. It's Vikings 1-0, Raiders 0-1.

Mothman wrote: I hear you but that's a team stat. It's Vikings 1-0, Raiders 0-1.

I know but it always seems to fall back on the QB, Teddy will be credited for beating or losing to the Packers this week, right or wrong

Mothman wrote: I hear you but that's a team stat. It's Vikings 1-0, Raiders 0-1.

They're all team stats, which is is why they aren't especially useful or informative for the purposes at hand.

fiestavike wrote: They're all team stats, which is is why they aren't especially useful or informative for the purposes at hand.

To some extent, they are all team stats. That's why I highlighted that quote from Billick above.

However, they aren't useless and they are informative. They tell us something about how the QBs are performing in their current circumstances (not nearly everything, but quite a bit).

Mothman wrote:

But as I said, they arent especially useful.

fiestavike wrote:But as I said, they arent especially useful.

Touché.

Something else to consider in defense of Teddy is that how many of the other QB's have a run first offense? I mean if you ask me, it completely messes with Teddy's ability to get into any kind of rhythm but YMMV.

However as I said before when I look with my eyes it tells a somewhat unflattering story when watching Teddy and as Jim posted about being in the second season and glimpsing your QB's potential I am confident we shouldn't give Teddy a pass either.

Watching Carr I have actually been somewhat impressed here and there but honestly I could say the same about Teddy. Subjectively speaking of course stats only show half the picture.

Mothman wrote: That's a generous assessment but it seems to give Bridgewater himself a pass. Cooper and Crabtree make a difference, no doubt, but I think the stats reflect a difference in physical ability and the mentality each player is bringing to the position. Carr has a more aggressive mentality this year and the arm to throw downfield, gun the ball into tight windows, etc. He also plays smart from the pocket and avoids sacks by getting rid of the ball.

Bridgewater holds the ball too long, has a far more conservative mentality and lacks the arm to make some of the throws Carr can make. It's not a coincidence that the Vikes have had little to no downfield passing game in windy, outdoor games of late, nor is it a coincidence Mike Wallace is on pace to have his least productive (full) season as a pro.

As I said up thread, it's too early to make a final determination about who will be the better QB but I think there's a clear leader in the "race" at this point...

... and Bortles, Mariota, Manziel and Winston haven't even been included.

I guess I'm just not buying the Vikings are having Bridgewater play the way he is strictly because of his arm strength. With the top defense in the NFL they know they can win as long as they don't go out of there way to help the other team get an advantage (talking turnovers here) so they play a safe game. With our O-line I think it definitely increases the risk of something bad happening the more Teddy has to drop back and throw it. We saw Bridgewater make more throws than he is now last season when AD was out and it was strictly about putting Teddy in the best spot while we were not in the playoff hunt.

I do believe the raiders are having Carr play the way he is because in doing so it gives them the best chance to win, it's simply not in our best interest to drop Teddy back 40+ times and Carr does not see the run / pass blitzes Teddy see's on a regular bases because of AD. I'm not trying to put words in anyone's mouth but I believe most people are biased on Carr simply because what they see looks better or looks like a how a QB should look. But again, we are a run first offense that knows if we can score 20 points with zero turnovers we will win almost all of our games.

Prevent defense is absolutely a thing in the NFL still and regardless of what people want to believe about carr, he has piled up a portion of his stats in unwinnable games in situations that Teddy simply doesn't get to face.

Anyway, I've said my piece with it, that's my opinion, hopefully for our sake I'm not just biased!

mondry wrote: I guess I'm just not buying the Vikings are having Bridgewater play the way he is strictly because of his arm strength. With the top defense in the NFL they know they can win as long as they don't go out of there way to help the other team get an advantage (talking turnovers here) so they play a safe game. With our O-line I think it definitely increases the risk of something bad happening the more Teddy has to drop back and throw it. We saw Bridgewater make more throws than he is now last season when AD was out and it was strictly about putting Teddy in the best spot while we were not in the playoff hunt.

I do believe the raiders are having Carr play the way he is because in doing so it gives them the best chance to win, it's simply not in our best interest to drop Teddy back 40+ times and Carr does not see the run / pass blitzes Teddy see's on a regular bases because of AD. I'm not trying to put words in anyone's mouth but I believe most people are biased on Carr simply because what they see looks better or looks like a how a QB should look. But again, we are a run first offense that knows if we can score 20 points with zero turnovers we will win almost all of our games.

Prevent defense is absolutely a thing in the NFL still and regardless of what people want to believe about carr, he has piled up a portion of his stats in unwinnable games in situations that Teddy simply doesn't get to face.

Anyway, I've said my piece with it, that's my opinion, hopefully for our sake I'm not just biased!

Its probably a combination of things. including Teddy's conservative personality. I think the coaches would like him to turn it loose a bit more, as they've indicated. It's a balancing act. I bet there are around 4 plays a game where they want to go for an aggressive downfield play, and Teddy needs to do better connecting on those shots.

fiestavike wrote:Its probably a combination of things. including Teddy's conservative personality. I think the coaches would like him to turn it loose a bit more, as they've indicated. It's a balancing act. I bet there are around 4 plays a game where they want to go for an aggressive downfield play, and Teddy needs to do better connecting on those shots.

That sounds about right.

Mondry, I wasn't suggesting the Vikings are having Bridgewater play the way he is strictly because of his arm strength, just that his arm strength is a factor in his overall performance.

Carr

Laserman wrote:Carr

He sure looked good losing to the lions and only putting up 13 points!

13 for 25 with 169 passing 0 TD's.

mondry wrote: He sure looked good losing to the lions and only putting up 13 points!

13 for 25 with 169 passing 0 TD's.

Teddy was certainly the better QB today.