Check Down Charlie

[PurpleKoolaid]

the coaches have said on film that ponder has no one to throw to because the wrs are not getting open...

youre really a hater. cant make a read to save his life? maybe the wrs and tes should make catches thrown right to their hands and chest in important situations. but hey, thats ponders fault too.

Show me the source where our coaching staff is throwing our receivers under the buss. Ive even heard the bonehead announcers talk about the open looks Ponder should be seeing. Again, give me your source please.

[smoothoperator]

its in a post on this board from earlier this year a week or two ago, after the detroit game i believe. im not going to waste my time looking for it. i know its on here though.

[Cliff]

its in a post on this board from earlier this year a week or two ago, after the detroit game i believe. im not going to waste my time looking for it. i know its on here though.

You're talking about this quote;

Musgrave did call several deep play-action fakes with extra protection -- clear indications the ball was supposed to go deep. Asked if receivers were open on any of those plays, Musgrave said, "They weren't, and that's not on Christian. That's on myself, the play-caller, and us as a staff designing plays.

http://www.1500espn.com/sportswire/Bill ... ld_O092012

That is in regards to one game though, it's not a statement about the WRs as a whole. Though I'm sure that is some of the problem.

[smoothoperator]

Yea thats it. I am sure that is a common thing they see on tape. We really need a big wr target and I think things would change the dynamic of this team quickly. We should have dished out the money for vincent jackson...

[Mothman]

Musgrave has said himself and the quote is in the post above me. Pelissero says it WEEKLY in his game break downs and he watches coaches tape.

I've been watching it this season too (on NFL.com) and I've seen the same thing.

Ponder has his faults but you saying its his fault we don't go deep more is asinine. It's one thing if he's proven he can't do it but he hasn't even attempted it. And that's on the WRs.

The thing is, he has attempted it and it's rarely worked because the receivers usually haven't been open and/or able to make the catch. On some of the plays where they've clearly wanted to go deep, the protection has broken down. All the #### and moaning this season about the lack of a deep game ignores too much of what is actually happening on the field.

[Eli]

None of it explains why the Vikings aren't using Harvin deep. He's caught deep balls in the past, he gets open, adjusts to balls in flight, is able to fight for a contested ball, and he has the speed to run a go route on nearly any corner in the league.

[Mothman]

None of it explains why the Vikings aren't using Harvin deep. He's caught deep balls in the past, he gets open, adjusts to balls in flight, is able to fight for a contested ball, and he has the speed to run a go route on nearly any corner in the league.

They just threw deep to him a week ago. Maybe they don't do it more often because they're already asking him to do a lot in the offense.

[Cliff]

They just threw deep to him a week ago. Maybe they don't do it more often because they're already asking him to do a lot in the offense.

That's a pretty strong possibility. What's that Harvin? Already doing so much you start to cramp up towards the end of games? Lets throw a dozen extra deep patterns in!

[dkoby]

That's a pretty strong possibility. What's that Harvin? Already doing so much you start to cramp up towards the end of games? Lets throw a dozen extra deep patterns in!

Not to mention that he is the only threat that is double covered and schemed for.

[thatguy]

You basically got one ... here are Tom Brady's stats from last night's NE Vs. SEA game;
36/58, 395 YDS, 2 TD, 2 INT

Ponder;
35/52, 352 YDS, 2 TD, 2 INT

lol that's my point. Even the best QBs don't have their best games every week.

[Infinity]

lol that's my point. Even the best QBs don't have their best games every week.

That is a good game, what are you talking about????

[Delaqure]

How am I so high on him? I've compared him to Chad Pennington many times on this board. Is that comparison that means I'm high on him? I even said he played below average today in that very post you've quoted.

I'm just not ready to give up on him yet and call him a scrub like you and others have deemed him from the moment he was drafted. I don't think he'll ever be an elite QB like Brady, Rodgers, Brees, etc but I'm not ready to call him a bust. If not being elite makes him a bust in your opinion then so be it.

All I was saying is the lack of down field passing game is not on him. We have nobody who can get open down the field if Simpson isn't in the lineup. The QB has no control over whether the WRs get open or not. If Ponder does take those shots and has to expect Aromashodu or slow Jenkins to make plays on the ball like Sidney Rice would the ball will most likely be incomplete or picked and then people would say "HE SUCKZZZZZ, THE GUY WASN'T EVEN OPEN!!!111"

I agree, that's exactly what he was doing on one of his picks. If he threw downfield with our receivers very often there would be a LOT more picks cause our guys can't get open enough for him to make a safe throw. When he does miss an open guy it's almost like he's saying OMG somebodys open, now what do I do? He so shocked and amazed that he loses his cool!

[VikingLord]

There isn't just check-downs and deep passes. There is a large area of the middle field that is, for the most part, not probed by Ponder. Some of it may be the receivers, but I think a lot of it is Ponder just not either seeing it or wanting to play it ultra-safe. That isn't necessarily a knock on Ponder because we don't know what he's being coached to do (more than likely, not take a lot of risks), but if the team doesn't try to exploit that area of the field the defense will creep up. That's what the Redskins did and they pretty much shut down the Viking running game after those first 3 long drives.

While I can't help but have nightmares about that floater to Madieu, it's hard for me to lay all of the blame at Ponder's feet. For the most part it just seemed that the Redskins rose to the challenge after that first quarter and just out-hustled the Vikings on both sides of the ball. Had the Vikes come away with TDs on those first 3 drives it would have been a very different game, but it's tough to win on the road and tougher to win when you have the sorts of lapses the Vikings had.

[Lash Man]

I guess all the Ponder haters have to say Peyton Manning sux too he just threw a terrible pass that was returned for 6 , and yes it was a check down but he still has to recognize that his receiver wasn't where he threw the pass , I am only posting this to show that ANY QB can make bad throws and decisions even the best of the best .

[PurpleKoolaid]

I guess all the Ponder haters have to say Peyton Manning sux too he just threw a terrible pass that was returned for 6 , and yes it was a check down but he still has to recognize that his receiver wasn't where he threw the pass , I am only posting this to show that ANY QB can make bad throws and decisions even the best of the best .

Who are the Ponder haters?