Vikings Message Board.Com

Kansas Viking wrote: Jerry Jones spent almost $800 million on the new Dallas Cowboys Stadium. The total cost of the stadium was $1.15 billion. Arlington voters raised taxes and provided $325 million and the NFL kicked in $150 million. Jones covered the rest.

That's what I thought. As much as I hate him, I have to give him props for getting and paying for) what he wanted.

I see, I stand corrected! What are the requirements for that 150 mill from the NFL btw? Seems like if wilf will pay 1/3rd and the nfl kicks in that 150 mill something should be feasible.

Patrick Reusse: Lessons of stadium diplomacy are lost on Vikings

Unlike the Twins, who realized that bullying and bluster go nowhere, the team is reviving the familiar tactic.

The Vikings were back in form last week, again dictating to the public, the politicians and the bureaucrats the extent to which they would participate in building a new home in which to conduct business.

It is time for someone with clout -- perhaps the new governor, Mark Dayton -- to tell these beggars that they will not be permitted to be so choosy.

The rest is at the link.

Jim

Mothman wrote:Patrick Reusse: Lessons of stadium diplomacy are lost on Vikings
The rest is at the link.

Jim

Well, I am just about convinced that this team won't be getting a new stadium anytime soon.

thatguy wrote: Please keep in mind that regardless of what the topic is, Strib commentators are easily the most cynical, nasty, and unfriendly people as a whole. Don't take too much stock into what they say. They must feel real important because they can essentially leave comments anonymously without ANY repercussions.

Oh most certainly. But in this case, they actually are pretty close to the pulse of what I believe is the feeling in Minnesota. No one wants them to leave, but this stance is unreasonable.

thatguy wrote:
The legislature just refuses to look at things in the long-term view and seem to only think that the upfront cost is what is on the table.

Sorry, can't put this one on the Legislature. They are facing some MAJOR cuts over the next few years, and that's assuming they actually increase tax revenue. Without increased revenues, the cuts are going to be brutal. Demanding public funding in the way the Vikings are approaching it right now is politically stupid. Really, really stupid.

The Strib article is dead on. The Vikings should have had a viable plan with a local partner brokered behind the scenes for the last legislative session. Instead they hired lobbyists at the 11th hour and prayed for a miracle, losing big with their ridiculously underfunded concept of using funding earned by team inspired activities only as the public contribution. This year they seem to be putting forth the same ridiculous nonsense from last session as the place to start, with the exception of adding overt threats like moving to LA and not paying for a roof as part of the rhetoric.

They are asking for a huge public commitment in a time of dire fiscal circumstances so I hope someone on the Vikings starts acting as a team player, working with the state rather than threatening. Otherwise, the Vikings may well leave for Los Angeles, victim of the triple sequence of an NFL CBA expiring at the same time their lease expires at the same time the state has a $6B deficit to work out. Stadiums are underlying principle of NFL ownership trying to get more money out of the union so I can see the Vikings used as a pawn in the process and moving out.

Normally, I would say the Vikings fan base is too strong for this to occur. But once Norman Green moved the North Stars out of hockey nirvana to hockey nowhere I lost all faith in sanity prevailing in sports. To me, the greatest worry is, much like the Wilf's have done little to show they know how to manage a football operation, they have done far less to show they are more than bungling buffoons in running a stadium drive. Sadly, the outcome may be bad for everyone.

CalVike wrote:Norman Green

GREED!

thatguy wrote:

The legislature just refuses to look at things in the long-term view and seem to only think that the upfront cost is what is on the table.

[/quote][/quote]

Too bad they never use those same standards for anything else they overspend the state into debt on

BGM wrote: Sorry, can't put this one on the Legislature. They are facing some MAJOR cuts over the next few years, and that's assuming they actually increase tax revenue. Without increased revenues, the cuts are going to be brutal. Demanding public funding in the way the Vikings are approaching it right now is politically stupid. Really, really stupid.

If that's the case, then you can start calling them the LA Vkings. If they can spend a state into debt like this, then they can spend $$$ on an investment like the Vikings.

BGM wrote: Sorry, can't put this one on the Legislature. They are facing some MAJOR cuts over the next few years, and that's assuming they actually increase tax revenue. Without increased revenues, the cuts are going to be brutal. Demanding public funding in the way the Vikings are approaching it right now is politically stupid. Really, really stupid.

Isn't it weird that the Vikings have been asking for a new stadium for at least a decade now? Tough luck if they have to make cuts...they shouldn't have waited to the last minute to try and squeeze the Vikings into their agenda.

The way the Vikings have jumped around on locations, roof, no roof, retractable roof, ect, I would be shocked if a deal gets done. They have so many plans, it seems they dont have a plan. A year ago or so, I was for the state kicking in some money, but with the Wilfs (and the pathetic Bagley) seeming to be wishy-washy, the terrible state of the Vikings organization, Minnesotas deficit, and the labor situation, Im not sure how any elected official could vote to give Ziggi hundreds of millions. If that means they move to LA, then they move to LA. Make a bed, you sleep in it.

BGM wrote: Sorry, can't put this one on the Legislature. They are facing some MAJOR cuts over the next few years, and that's assuming they actually increase tax revenue. Without increased revenues, the cuts are going to be brutal. Demanding public funding in the way the Vikings are approaching it right now is politically stupid. Really, really stupid.

I have to say that they each bare responsibility. the legislature has shot down different forms of funding in the last few years that would have built what the wilfs wanted in the first place, a stadium with a retractable roof. Now that the economic environment is quite different, the political environment is different also. I think they need to go back to the racino concept of fundraising and give that another shot. I think with the changing political winds, if they could find a lot of funding that does not burden the taxpayers, it will likely pass now.

As for the Vikings being wishy-washy, I think they just realize the economic timing here and just want a new place. I'm sure they still really want a retractable roofed stadium, they have just been shot down with all their previous efforts to secure funding for their dream situation. One thing I know for sure, They want out of the dome as soon as possible.

purple guy wrote:The way the Vikings have jumped around on locations, roof, no roof, retractable roof, ect, I would be shocked if a deal gets done. They have so many plans, it seems they dont have a plan. A year ago or so, I was for the state kicking in some money, but with the Wilfs (and the pathetic Bagley) seeming to be wishy-washy, the terrible state of the Vikings organization...

What's the point of having a plan if you know the legislature isn't even going to consider it?

And the terrible state of the Vikings? That's how short-term thinking works. It's not like our franchise will NEVER be successful again...they just hit a rough patch where some things are in disarray. I hate when people base the "state" of the franchise off of a year or two. Think long-term.

Oh and for your "labor situation" argument...don't you think that it will take thousands of people doing labor to build this stadium? I think that's why basically all of the construction unions are behind it...

thatguy wrote: What's the point of having a plan if you know the legislature isn't even going to consider it?

And the terrible state of the Vikings? That's how short-term thinking works. It's not like our franchise will NEVER be successful again...they just hit a rough patch where some things are in disarray. I hate when people base the "state" of the franchise off of a year or two. Think long-term.

Oh and for your "labor situation" argument...don't you think that it will take thousands of people doing labor to build this stadium? I think that's why basically all of the construction unions are behind it...

I meant the CBA in the NFL, THAT labor situation.....

As far as the long term state of the Vikings, yea, Im sure they will turn it around, but they NEED a stadium and they need it NOW, so my bet is, knowing how most politicians work, they will think shrt term, worry about themselves and fail to see the long term benefit of the state having the Vikings. I have no doubt the Vikings will bbe successful again, but it could very well be in LA or another location.

As far as not having a solid plan and sticking to it because they know it will fail??? I guess Im not a fan of that train of thought. Do they think it will be more likely to get passed if they jump around from location to location and from style of stadium to style of stadium?? If I had a vote, Id be leery that they lack a solid plan, as it seems to change as often as the weather in Minnesota. The Vikings seem to be trying to get as much state funding as possible, contributing as little as possible, and changing their vision for the stadium and its location/style so often, its tough to be confident they know what they are doing or even know what they want. I love the Vikings and hope they dont move, but, IMO, they arent doing themselves many favors, especially the last 2 years. And Bagley is definately not the right guy to lead the effort IMO.