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Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 3:11 pm
by Delaqure
PurpleKoolaid wrote:Teddy looks good, but he doesn't look a lot better then Zach or Boyd or even Carr. Hes so frail. JFB can kiss my bum. I hope we trade it, get a project QB, and go D then guards.
I really doubt we go D and Guards with a #1 or #2 pick. QB is our biggest need and a QB will be our first pick. It will be a crap shoot at the pick for QB. It always is. And I hope we don't look at Bridgewater's frailty. We need to look at his accuracy, leadership and ability to read the field not his weight. The guy can play football from what I have seen and read. Not saying he is a sure fire #1 hall of fame, pro bowler QB for sure. I don't rightly know and we won't know until he takes the field. All I know is he won't be a "reach." I don't get the draft a project QB mentality. For the vast majority of the time it never works out. Brady is a rarity.
We absolutely need defensive people too. So, I would pick the QB and go for defense and O line for the remainder of the draft.
Don't know much about Zach or Boyd so I will have to take a look at them.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 3:46 pm
by purplehaze
Here are some stats through 10 games. I know who I would want wearing purple.
Total yards
1. Manziel (3,924)
2. Mariota (3,026)
3. Winston (2,818)
4. Petty (2,775)
5. AJ (2,019)
Total yards per game
1. Manziel (392.4)
2. Petty (346.9)
3. Mariota (336.2)
4. Winston (313.1)
5. AJ (224.3)
Total passing yards
1. Manziel (3,313)
2. Winston (2,661)
3. Petty (2,657)
4. Mariota (2,531)
5. AJ (2,041)
Passing yards per game
1. Petty (332.1)
2. Manziel (331.3)
3. Winston (295.7)
4. Mariota (281)
5. AJ (226.7)
Total rushing yards
1. Manziel (611)
2. Mariota (495)
3. Winston (157)
4. Petty (118)
5. AJ (-22)
Rushing yards per game
1. Manziel (61)
2. Mariota (55)
3. Winston (17)
4. Petty (15)
5. AJ (negative 2)
Total TDs
1. Manziel (39)
2. Mariota (31)
3. Winston (29)
3. Petty (29)
5. AJ (19)
Passing TDs
1. Manziel (31)
2. Winston (26)
3. Mariota (22)
4. Petty (21)
5. AJ (19)
Rushing TDs
1. Mariota (9)
2. Manziel (8)
2. Petty (8)
4. Winston (3)
5. AJ (zero)
Avg. TDs per game
1. Manziel (3.9)
2. Petty (3.6)
3. Mariota (3.4)
4. Winston (3.2)
5. AJ (2.1)
Completion percentage
1. Manziel (230/315 = 73 percent)
2. McCarron (159/229 = 69.4 percent)
3. Winston (166/240 = 69.2 percent)
4. Petty (135/202 = 66.8 percent)
5. Mariota (164/259 = 63 percent)
Interception per pass attempt ratio
1. Mariota ( 0/259 = 0)
2. Petty ( 1/202 = 0.495 percent)
3. AJ ( 3/229 = 1.31 percent)
4. Winston ( 7/240 = 2.92 percent)
5. Manziel ( 11/315 = 3.49 percent)
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 6:07 pm
by mondry
Mothman wrote:
Then why did they win 2 of their last 3 games that season? If they were intentionally tanking it, why win those games? Was that all part of the tapestry of deception they were creating?
I think it's simply because they built enough cushion at that point to win a couple games and have it still not matter, like you said, it was 2 of their last 3 games. When it did matter again they went ahead and lost to the then 4-11 jaguars in week 17. Both us and the Rams had 2 wins by week 10 and I think a tougher strength of schedule so a tie would be in their favor. (for sure with the rams since that's how it worked out anyway)
Most people against "tanking" have this idea that you force the team to lose when all it really is is doing what you can to not win. For example, you start Curtis Painter (Ponder) because you want to "identify him for the future" when you know starting Cassel could win you a meaningless game or two. It's not a bad thing, the franchise just needs to know what it has in certain players to find out if they're part of the future or not.
In our case, we're tanking now by leaving Frazier in as head coach because he's the ultimate example of play not to lose. I'm really happy they're letting him "do his job" till the end. In this case, just keeping the status quo is our version of tanking. The best example I can think to show the opposite of this is the cleveland browns this year. They started off 0-3 I think and traded their RB, started the 3rd string QB. Normally these would be examples of "tanking on purpose" but instead it had the opposite effect and gave the team a spark. Instead of the same conservative play not to lose mentality they try to win and go for not only a fake punt but also a fake field goal. Had they played a normal conservative game against us, which is what Frazier is all about, we beat them easy.
Just shedding some light on the subject! The coaches don't actually go in and say "NO MATTER WHAT YOU GUYS NEED TO LOSE THIS GAME FOR US!" Guys are too prideful and not to mention trying to put out good tape for obvious personal reasons. However, there are some guys you can leave in charge, or starting at QB, or starting at CB, or starting at LB, etc etc who just aren't very good so no matter how hard they try it's futile.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 7:51 pm
by Mothman
mondry wrote:I think it's simply because they built enough cushion at that point to win a couple games and have it still not matter, like you said, it was 2 of their last 3 games. When it did matter again they went ahead and lost to the then 4-11 jaguars in week 17. Both us and the Rams had 2 wins by week 10 and I think a tougher strength of schedule so a tie would be in their favor. (for sure with the rams since that's how it worked out anyway)
Most people against "tanking" have this idea that you force the team to lose when all it really is is doing what you can to not win. For example, you start Curtis Painter (Ponder) because you want to "identify him for the future" when you know starting Cassel could win you a meaningless game or two. It's not a bad thing, the franchise just needs to know what it has in certain players to find out if they're part of the future or not.
In our case, we're tanking now by leaving Frazier in as head coach because he's the ultimate example of play not to lose. I'm really happy they're letting him "do his job" till the end. In this case, just keeping the status quo is our version of tanking. The best example I can think to show the opposite of this is the cleveland browns this year. They started off 0-3 I think and traded their RB, started the 3rd string QB. Normally these would be examples of "tanking on purpose" but instead it had the opposite effect and gave the team a spark. Instead of the same conservative play not to lose mentality they try to win and go for not only a fake punt but also a fake field goal. Had they played a normal conservative game against us, which is what Frazier is all about, we beat them easy.
Just shedding some light on the subject! The coaches don't actually go in and say "NO MATTER WHAT YOU GUYS NEED TO LOSE THIS GAME FOR US!" Guys are too prideful and not to mention trying to put out good tape for obvious personal reasons. However, there are some guys you can leave in charge, or starting at QB, or starting at CB, or starting at LB, etc etc who just aren't very good so no matter how hard they try it's futile.
I appreciate your effort to sell it but I'm not buying.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 9:01 pm
by Raptorman
I'll say this. Not in the history of the team have the Vikings ever picked first due to the previous seasons record. If it happens this year, it will be a first. And I suppose I can live with that. As long as they don't pick a bust.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 9:01 pm
by purplehaze
80 PurplePride 84 wrote:
And I'm sure if you look back to prior years you'll see NFL studs such as Jason White, Troy Smith, Matt Leinart and Tim Tebow at or near the top of all those categories too.
I suppose if you dig back in the archives you can say the same thing about John Elway, Dan Marino, Roger Staubach, Peyton Manning, Steve Young, Joe Montana, Joe Namath etc. etc etc.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 9:31 pm
by TremorVike13
We could nick name him Johnny V!
V is is for victory and viking - get it, huh, huh, get it?
Im up for anything as long as we dont have this coach.
Lets go 1 and 6 before we try the hurry up, or get aggressive, or anything other than plain vanilla.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 9:48 pm
by Reignman
2006 Colt Brennan ... 406/559, 5549 yards, 58 TD, 12 INT, 186.0 rating, 366 rushing yards. Where's he at? College stats mean nothing, they gotta pass the eye test. Ponder doesn't and neither does Manziel. Manziel would be better than Ponder, but that doesn't mean much. Everyone that has thrown a pass in this league has been better than Ponder, except maybe Tebow. Manziel will be in the arena league 3 years after he's drafted.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:36 pm
by im4mnvikes
Reignman wrote:2006 Colt Brennan ... 406/559, 5549 yards, 58 TD, 12 INT, 186.0 rating, 366 rushing yards. Where's he at? College stats mean nothing, they gotta pass the eye test. Ponder doesn't and neither does Manziel. Manziel would be better than Ponder, but that doesn't mean much. Everyone that has thrown a pass in this league has been better than Ponder, except maybe Tebow. Manziel will be in the arena league 3 years after he's drafted.
I am not sold on Johnny Football yet but his stats are againt SEC teams. Colt Brennan's stats were against the WAC(Mountain West) teams. Not a good comparison.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:51 am
by PurpleMustReign
Why are people down on Aaron Murray? His stats are probably better than Manziel's.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:21 pm
by Demi
PurpleMustReign wrote:Why are people down on Aaron Murray? His stats are probably better than Manziel's.
Because he's a midget. I'm sold on him, and I hate midgets. Guy still gets passes batted down and has issues there...could be a bigger issue in the NFL, but overall I'd take him over everyone other than Bridgewater....
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:43 pm
by VikingLord
Reignman wrote:2006 Colt Brennan ... 406/559, 5549 yards, 58 TD, 12 INT, 186.0 rating, 366 rushing yards. Where's he at? College stats mean nothing, they gotta pass the eye test. Ponder doesn't and neither does Manziel. Manziel would be better than Ponder, but that doesn't mean much. Everyone that has thrown a pass in this league has been better than Ponder, except maybe Tebow. Manziel will be in the arena league 3 years after he's drafted.
I'd take that bet.
Comparing Brennan to Manziel is laughable. The two faced a completely different level of competition while in college. Manziel has gotten better despite very good defenses having plenty of time to gameplan to stop him.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:44 pm
by S197
Boon wrote:
and marcus "staredown" mariotta passes the eye test?
For a guy that stares down receivers he sure doesn't throw a lot of picks.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:47 pm
by VikingLord
PurpleMustReign wrote:Why are people down on Aaron Murray? His stats are probably better than Manziel's.
His stats aren't better than Manziel's. The only other college QB's who are in Manziel's league this year are Bridgewater and Carr in terms of stats like completion % and yards passing.
I'm not down on Murray, but he's not a 1st round prospect and I don't see him going before round 3. He has some potential, but has to improve his consistency.
Re: Draft Status
Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 12:04 am
by Reignman
Boon wrote:
and marcus "staredown" mariotta passes the eye test?
I haven't seen him play live so I couldn't say if he passes the eye test. I have seen Manziel play a few times and I'm not impressed. In fact his receiver Evans impresses me more. McCarron passes the eye test and he plays the same SEC defenses. I can see his game working in the NFL. Manziels backyard ball just isn't going to work vs NFL defenses.
And although the SEC has several of the better teams in college football, it doesn't mean you're going up against NFL caliber defenses every week. The best defense in college football would be no better than the worst NFL defense anyway.
SEC defensive ranks. Other than Alabama and maybe Florida or Missouri, the SEC doesn't have much to brag about in the defensive department.
Code: Select all
BCS comp pass rush rush tot
W-L rank pts pct yds yds avg yds
Alabama 10-0 1 1 11 9 3 5 5
Auburn 10-1 27 45 100 50 69 69
Texas A&M 8-2 12 84 32 90 104 110 110
Mississippi 7-3 24 49 102 47 42 58 58
LSU 7-3 22 39 55 18 49 45 45
Mississippi St. 4-6 62 90 55 38 76 76
Arkansas 3-7 91 110 59 73 82 82
Missouri 9-1 8 20 91 113 14 15 15
South Carolina 8-2 22 73 15 45 59 59
Georgia 6-4 96 74 89 61 49 49
Vanderbilt 6-4 63 107 49 40 57 57
Florida 4-6 14 4 8 15 27 27
Tennessee 4-6 95 19 26 109 115 115
Kentucky 2-8 76 111 43 92 93 93
S197 wrote:For a guy that stares down receivers he sure doesn't throw a lot of picks.
Haha yeah, 0 INT's with 25 TD's. If he can put up those kind of numbers after staring down his receivers then he would be a good project. Manziel has 11 INT's, so I guess Evans doesn't win every jump ball xD.