We still have a chance

[tmscr]

We couldn't be more opposite in our thinking. The year Green Bay went 15-1, their defense was historically lousy. But they could outscore everyone because of Rodgers. How many game will the Pack win without him this year?

If you look at individual games this year, slightly better QB play could have won at least three more - just one play in each of those games where the Vikes had a late 4th quarter lead! If the Vikes were 5-4, and didn't have those long 80 yard drives against the defense at the tired end of the game because the offense picked up one more first down, the stats would look better and we frankly wouldn't be having all these doom and gloom conversations.

As for getting mid-round QB's, it's a crap shoot. You mention Russell Wilson, but go ahead and name the 20 other 3rd round QB picks who didn't turn out so well. I think we should have been drafting one QB each year late, and picking up another in rookie FA (Case Keenum anyone?), but even so, there's no way to effectively evaluate those guys until they get starts. If Kurt Warner and Tom Brady had showed up so well in training camp and practice, they wouldn't have needed injuries to get their first starts.

Right now, I wish the Vikes had gone 1-15 in Frazier's first year instead of 3-13 (I enjoyed the wins when they happened, but it gets us only a solid left tackle on a losing team now). Andrew Luck will have his teams on the verge of the playoffs regardless of who is around him for years.

aaron rodgers had a plethora of very talented receivers to help along the way. the vikings don't have that just yet. you can say slightly better QB would have won any of our close games this year, but you could say slightly better defensive play, much better offensive line play and even slightly better coaching could have won those games. a great QB (assuming there is one in the draft) surrounded by below average players (you don't get to 2-7 by being anything other than below average) means nothing. now, I would agree with you if andrew luck is in the draft, but he just flat out isn't.

[King James]

So this is what it comes down to now? Hoping the Vikings lose in order to get the top draft pick. Wow.

[saint33]

disagree. you will never win a championship with a defense that can't 1) stop the pass and 2) get off the field. also, a great QB with no offensive line means nothing. now, you can be merely average at those areas and go after a QB. the problem is, the vikings are very below average on the offensive line and defense as a whole. far too many other areas of concern to reach for another QB in the first round, when no QB is head and shoulders above the rest.

people forget you can draft a QB after the 5th pick in round 1:

joe flacco (18 in round 1)
jay cutler (11 in round 1)
aaron rodgers (24th in round 1)
roethlisberger (11th in round 1)
russell wilson (3)
kaepernick (2)
andy dalton (2)
matt schaub (3)
drew brees (2)
tom brady (6)

tony romo wasn't drafted.

meanwhile, here are a few guys taken in round 1 since 2010:

tim tebow
ponder
blaine gabbert
brandon weeden

sure you can get a QB in a later round, that's been proven time and time again. It's also been proven that much more often than not, 2nd-7th round QBs do not turn into franchise QBs.

However, in this discussion of trying to get the #1 pick to get the best QB available, how about we look at the recent history of QBs drafted #1 overall. This is a list of QBs drafted #1 overall in the past 10 years

Andrew Luck
Cam Newton
Sam Bradford
Matthew Stafford
JaMarcus Russell
Alex Smith
Eli Manning


outside of russell, and maybe Bradford, I'd be happy

[tmscr]

sure you can get a QB in a later round, that's been proven time and time again. It's also been proven that much more often than not, 2nd-7th round QBs do not turn into franchise QBs.

However, in this discussion of trying to get the #1 pick to get the best QB available, how about we look at the recent history of QBs drafted #1 overall. This is a list of QBs drafted #1 overall in the past 10 years

Andrew Luck
Cam Newton
Sam Bradford
Matthew Stafford
JaMarcus Russell
Alex Smith
Eli Manning


outside of russell, and maybe Bradford, I'd be happy

I understand what you're saying, but aside from Eli and his two rings, here are the playoff wins for those QBs:

Luck: 0
Newton: 0
Bradford: 0
Stafford: 0
Russell: 0
Smith: 1

As you said, outside of Russell and maybe Bradford, those guys are all upgrades over what we have. But still, Manning is the only one with real playoff success, and no one like him is in this draft either.

[Turtle Burger]

It's lame, and as far as I'm concerned it's all the NFL's fault. With the draft becoming more important and popular and the NFL rewarding suckage, it's inevitable that every year fans will turn against their own teams hoping for better draft position. They should give the #1 pick to the best team not to make the playoffs, and work down from there; that way everyone has a reason to cheer for their team to win.

[Purple bruise]

sure you can get a QB in a later round, that's been proven time and time again. It's also been proven that much more often than not, 2nd-7th round QBs do not turn into franchise QBs.

However, in this discussion of trying to get the #1 pick to get the best QB available, how about we look at the recent history of QBs drafted #1 overall. This is a list of QBs drafted #1 overall in the past 10 years

Andrew Luck
Cam Newton
Sam Bradford
Matthew Stafford
JaMarcus Russell
Alex Smith
Eli Manning


outside of russell, and maybe Bradford, I'd be happy

Did you forget to list the infamous Vince Young taken with the 3rd overall pick in the 2006 draft (a cant miss guy)

[mondry]

I understand what you're saying, but aside from Eli and his two rings, here are the playoff wins for those QBs:

Luck: 0
Newton: 0
Bradford: 0
Stafford: 0
Russell: 0
Smith: 1

As you said, outside of Russell and maybe Bradford, those guys are all upgrades over what we have. But still, Manning is the only one with real playoff success, and no one like him is in this draft either.

And after this year 4 of them have a pretty strong chance to have some playoff success and it could easily look like

Luck: 1-2
Newton: 1-2
Bradford: 0
Stafford: 1-2
Russell: 0
Smith 2-3

No one in this draft as good as eli manning?

[mondry]

Did you forget to list the infamous Vince Young taken with the 3rd overall pick in the 2006 draft (a cant miss guy)

Did you forget to read the part that says "this is a list of QB's drafted #1 overall in the past 10 years" ????

[tmscr]

And after this year 4 of them have a pretty strong chance to have some playoff success and it could easily look like

Luck: 1-2
Newton: 1-2
Bradford: 0
Stafford: 1-2
Russell: 0
Smith 2-3

No one in this draft as good as eli manning?

what's so funny? the guy has two rings. yes, this year hasn't been one to remember for him, but are you saying teddy bridgewater has the same skills going into the draft as Eli did? johnny football?

[Funkytown]

Did you forget to read the part that says "this is a list of QB's drafted #1 overall in the past 10 years" ????

Ooo, gonna need some aloe for that burn.

Admittedly, I have moments where I want it to be the offseason just so the bleeding stops, but it's far too early for me to get in full draft mode. Besides, it might suck for us this year, but there's plenty of good football to watch elsewhere. And I think it's safe to say that regardless of where we pick, and who we pick, there will be love and there will be hate. What's the big news? I just pray we don't miss on our first pick, especially if it's quarterback and really early. I've had just about enough of the "12th overall draft pick rah rah rah" stuff. I don't want to imagine the disgust of a top 5 pick quarterback bust. *sigh* Yeah. Totally not ready for the draft. lol.

[majorm]

We couldn't be more opposite in our thinking. The year Green Bay went 15-1, their defense was historically lousy. But they could outscore everyone because of Rodgers. How many game will the Pack win without him this year?

If you look at individual games this year, slightly better QB play could have won at least three more - just one play in each of those games where the Vikes had a late 4th quarter lead! If the Vikes were 5-4, and didn't have those long 80 yard drives against the defense at the tired end of the game because the offense picked up one more first down, the stats would look better and we frankly wouldn't be having all these doom and gloom conversations.

As for getting mid-round QB's, it's a crap shoot. You mention Russell Wilson, but go ahead and name the 20 other 3rd round QB picks who didn't turn out so well. I think we should have been drafting one QB each year late, and picking up another in rookie FA (Case Keenum anyone?), but even so, there's no way to effectively evaluate those guys until they get starts. If Kurt Warner and Tom Brady had showed up so well in training camp and practice, they wouldn't have needed injuries to get their first starts.

Right now, I wish the Vikes had gone 1-15 in Frazier's first year instead of 3-13 (I enjoyed the wins when they happened, but it gets us only a solid left tackle on a losing team now). Andrew Luck will have his teams on the verge of the playoffs regardless of who is around him for years.

Absolutely! I will take my chances anytime with a QB like Rodgers or Brees and a below average defense. This is a QB league. It's much eaiser to fill in pieces on the defense in free agency or later in the draft than hit on THE QB.

And as for getting a franchise QB later in the draft; sure it's happened, but your chances are quite a bit better when you're drafting at the top. Plus I don't have much faith in slick Rick out-smarting other GMs and landing a top QB that somebody else passed on.

Now I do agree that at this point there doesn't seem to be a clear-cut #1 guy like Luck or RG3, so it will take some careful evaluation and a bit of luck to get that guy that can set your franchise up for years. And not set it BACK years like Ponder has.

[PurpleMustReign]

It's lame, and as far as I'm concerned it's all the NFL's fault. With the draft becoming more important and popular and the NFL rewarding suckage, it's inevitable that every year fans will turn against their own teams hoping for better draft position. They should give the #1 pick to the best team not to make the playoffs, and work down from there; that way everyone has a reason to cheer for their team to win.

I like the concept... Its interesting. I'll have to chew on that for a bit.

[psjordan]

I really thought they were going to get there in both '87 and '98. I sure hope their day is coming soon. I'd like to see them win the Super Bowl at least once in my lifetime!

As a lifelong, born and bred Red Sox fan (who spent this past Saturday in 35 degrees wandering around Fenway just to ... absorb), I can relate. I can also tell you that the WS win in '04 was stupendously fun. The wait makes it worth it. Not that I'm a nannypants or anything, but seeing the '04 final out, front page of the Globe done up in a poster in the media room at Fenway actually brought tears and a wild laugh. Again.
Vikes will get there. I am convinced of that. We will celebrate like complete fools.

Oh and weighing in on the "hoping to lose" thing, that's not for me. I'm comfortable winning whenever we can and just having to be that much smarter at draft time. I have no idea what or who will be the FO come next April, so I root for wins now.

[majorm]

As a lifelong, born and bred Red Sox fan (who spent this past Saturday in 35 degrees wandering around Fenway just to ... absorb), I can relate. I can also tell you that the WS win in '04 was stupendously fun. The wait makes it worth it. Not that I'm a nannypants or anything, but seeing the '04 final out, front page of the Globe done up in a poster in the media room at Fenway actually brought tears and a wild laugh. Again.
Vikes will get there. I am convinced of that. We will celebrate like complete fools.

Oh and weighing in on the "hoping to lose" thing, that's not for me. I'm comfortable winning whenever we can and just having to be that much smarter at draft time. I have no idea what or who will be the FO come next April, so I root for wins now.

Ha, ha. Nannypants. I have no doubt that I will shed tears when/if the Vikings ever win the Super Bowl. Silly as it may seem to cry over a sports team, you just get so emotionally attached. It's why no matter how mad they make me and how bad I wish I could just root for a different team; you just can't do it.

Now I have seen my other teams win championships. I live in the KC area and loved it when the Royals won the Series back in 1985. Of course no post-season for them since! I root for Kansas basketball and it was awesome when they won in '08. But the Vikings are just different. I rooted for them long before I moved to KC and have suffered so much. I think I might cry now.

[Mothman]

As a lifelong, born and bred Red Sox fan (who spent this past Saturday in 35 degrees wandering around Fenway just to ... absorb), I can relate. I can also tell you that the WS win in '04 was stupendously fun. The wait makes it worth it. Not that I'm a nannypants or anything, but seeing the '04 final out, front page of the Globe done up in a poster in the media room at Fenway actually brought tears and a wild laugh. Again.
Vikes will get there. I am convinced of that. We will celebrate like complete fools.

Yes, we will!

I'm glad you had that experience and I don't consider you a nannypants (LOL!) for shedding a few tears.

I definitely know how much fun it can be to see a team you cheer for win a championship. I've actually seen all of my favorite teams do it now except the Vikings, who I've followed longer and care about more than the others combined. So it goes...