An Idea For a Trade

[J. Kapp 11]

You make good arguments. I don't agree with most of them, but that's all a matter of opinion.

The one comment I take exception to is the idea that this is a "desperation" move. You said yourself that the Cardinals would never go for it. If that's the case, it's far from desperate.

As for Harvin's misdeeds, I'm surprised at your comments. It's fairly common knowledge. Here are some citings.

From NBC Sports.

From CBS Chicago.

From ESPN.

From Tom Pelissero.

And the most damning, from The Sporting News.

I don't think there's any question that Percy Harvin has been -- to give Percy the benefit of the doubt -- "mercurial" throughout his college and NFL career. He wouldn't be my standard bearer for young players to look up to. Is he a complete malcontent that shouldn't be on the roster? Nope. Does his phenomenal play offset his misdeeds? Probably, yeah. But a shining example of mature adult behavior? Not really.

Honestly, you're right ... this trade is about as likely to happen as Benjamin Netanyahu and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad holding hands in public. But it's one that I'd look into if I were GM. (Go ahead ... "I'm sure glad YOU'RE not GM." )

[PurpleJarl]

Okay what about this? Just out of curiosity. Assuming that the Cards are ball. Using only draft picks how much would you be willing to give up for Larry? And how much do you think the Cards would ask for?



As in. a 1st 3rd and 4th for Larry or whatever?

[akvikingsfan]

Okay what about this? Just out of curiosity. Assuming that the Cards are ball. Using only draft picks how much would you be willing to give up for Larry? And how much do you think the Cards would ask for?



As in. a 1st 3rd and 4th for Larry or whatever?

This years 1st, 2nd, 5th, next years 1st and 3rd. He would cost way to much in a trade.

[J. Kapp 11]

Okay what about this? Just out of curiosity. Assuming that the Cards are ball. Using only draft picks how much would you be willing to give up for Larry? And how much do you think the Cards would ask for?



As in. a 1st 3rd and 4th for Larry or whatever?

Wow. Now there's a pipe dream.

Hard to say. A first and fourth, maybe. I honestly don't know what his value would be.

As for my previous comments about trading for him ... I might have to amend those.

Fitzgerald's contract extension, signed in 2011, guaranteed him $50 million and doesn't have many outs to keep the total value below the listed maximum of $128.5 million. Fitzgerald has option and roster bonuses due in 2012, 2013, and 2015 that keep him extremely expensive both in terms of the cap and cash on hand.

Link to this very interesting article on the top 50 players in terms of trade value.

Yikes ... "doesn't have many outs to keep him below the listed maximum of $128.5 million" means, "Yep. He's too expensive."

[Demi]

Yikes ... "doesn't have many outs to keep him below the listed maximum of $128.5 million" means, "Yep. He's too expensive."

And besides that I think no matter who's interested, there is no way it happens with Harvin holding the cards he does. He'll have to agree to an extension no matter where he goes, I doubt a team would make a move for him if he hadn't assured them it would happen. And it seems like there's no way he'd agree to it going to a team like the Cardinals.

The more I think about it, the more it seems a Patriots trade for a couple mid-round picks, or maybe a deal to San Franciso involving Alex Smith would be closer to what we'd actually be able to do, all parties on the same page.

[Purple bruise]

I would like to see Harvin extended. If some trade deal is made I hope that they trade him out of the division amd preferredly out of the conference. I would hate to see the Vikings face him in the division, he is, when healthy, one of the most dynamic players in the NFL.
If they retain him and aquire the deep threat that they so desperately need then this team will be hard to stop with AD.

[VikingLord]

As for Harvin's misdeeds, I'm surprised at your comments. It's fairly common knowledge. Here are some citings.

These 3 are all related to Harvin's college days:

From NBC Sports.

From CBS Chicago.

And the most damning, from The Sporting News.

These are directly relevant to Harvin's days in Minnesota, but they share the common trait of these allegations in that they are all from "sources" and written by people who were not there.

From ESPN.

From Tom Pelissero.

I don't think there's any question that Percy Harvin has been -- to give Percy the benefit of the doubt -- "mercurial" throughout his college and NFL career. He wouldn't be my standard bearer for young players to look up to. Is he a complete malcontent that shouldn't be on the roster? Nope. Does his phenomenal play offset his misdeeds? Probably, yeah. But a shining example of mature adult behavior? Not really.

I don't know. It depends on what you are looking for him to demonstrate. If you're talking about adult behavior, that's one thing. If you're talking about how to play hard, I can imagine few who would be better to emulate.

Honestly, you're right ... this trade is about as likely to happen as Benjamin Netanyahu and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad holding hands in public. But it's one that I'd look into if I were GM. (Go ahead ... "I'm sure glad YOU'RE not GM." )

I would not trade Harvin for Fitzgerald. I would not trade draft picks for Fitzgerald (too old and too expensive). Spielman's patient approach is the right one and the example of the Packers is the right approach. Good WR's can be found and developed via the draft even in later rounds. Heck, Jarius Wright is a good example of that. Spielman gets another shot this year and I expect him to use one of the first 3 picks the Vikings have on a WR.

I don't think the situation at WR is as dire as it appears.

[J. Kapp 11]

These are directly relevant to Harvin's days in Minnesota, but they share the common trait of these allegations in that they are all from "sources" and written by people who were not there.

C'mon, man. They also quote people who were there, including teammates. This is what solid enterprise reporting is all about. You investigate thoroughly, as Sporting News did for over three months, before you go to press. Good grief, people believe rumors on freaking Twitter but they don't believe true investigative reporting? Incredible.

Read the part about Harvin and Aaron Hernandez being completely healthy all week in practice, then suddenly wearing matching casts on their foot ... all nicely coinciding with getting busted for dope. They sat out the opener against a weak opponent, supposedly injured, but "sources" say it was all a ruse to keep the drug incidents out of the press. Work eithic? How about the reports that Harvin got fed up with hard conditioning workouts, and teammates found him playing basketball the next day as his "conditioning." And those sources ... they were Harvin's own teammates, not some unnamed ghost. That's what happens when stars get special treatment. Teammates get pissed. And they talk.

Heck, the story isn't even about Harvin. It's about the fall of the Florida program. A program that was unstoppable for a few years, and then all of a sudden was, in Meyer's own words, "broken beyond repair." Really, Urban? And you can't figure out what happened? As pointed out in the article, the special treatment of Harvin, Hernandez and other stars on the team was huge contributor to a huge rift in the locker room and eventually the program's sudden demise. Then poor Urban sits out for a year for "health reasons" but suddenly, miraculously, recovers to take the Ohio State job. Right. Good luck, Columbus.

Harvin, by most accounts, has been a decent pro where his behavior is concerned. But there also have been unmistakeable signs of his Florida ways. Harvin's a great player, but he's no saint.

[PurpleJarl]

I agree with you complete about building through the draft versus picking up an aging receiver. However I do see one serious advantage to doing this. taking Fitz for example (even though we have determined that it is highly unlikely). It allows us to judge ponder and another QBs more completely without always having the suspect receiver argument. We know he can get separation, we know he can beat double coverage, we know he can fight for jump balls. This would gives us a route to quickly look at the viability of a QB without needed several seasons to see if they can deliver.

[saint33]

but he's no saint.

No doubt, but that's high expectations for anyone

[PurpleJarl]

No doubt, but that's high expectations for anyone

But is it? These men get paid millions upon millions of dollars to play a game which, they could retire from after a single a year and be set for life. Percy is 24 he wont even be thirty by the time his next MASSIVE contract is up. I don't care what he does once he stops playing the game, but its really sad that we have come to point were we don't even expect a man who we are giving his dreams to on a silver platter to be able to be an upstanding citizen. Not picking a fight, just a random comment about it.

So, any other trade prospects at wide receiver besides pipe dreams? Is there even a team out there that has more than 1 "#1 receiver" size wise? I can really think of one.

[Texas Vike]

C'mon, man. They also quote people who were there, including teammates. This is what solid enterprise reporting is all about. You investigate thoroughly, as Sporting News did for over three months, before you go to press. Good grief, people believe rumors on freaking Twitter but they don't believe true investigative reporting? Incredible.

Read the part about Harvin and Aaron Hernandez being completely healthy all week in practice, then suddenly wearing matching casts on their foot ... all nicely coinciding with getting busted for dope. They sat out the opener against a weak opponent, supposedly injured, but "sources" say it was all a ruse to keep the drug incidents out of the press. Work eithic? How about the reports that Harvin got fed up with hard conditioning workouts, and teammates found him playing basketball the next day as his "conditioning." And those sources ... they were Harvin's own teammates, not some unnamed ghost. That's what happens when stars get special treatment. Teammates get pissed. And they talk.

Heck, the story isn't even about Harvin. It's about the fall of the Florida program. A program that was unstoppable for a few years, and then all of a sudden was, in Meyer's own words, "broken beyond repair." Really, Urban? And you can't figure out what happened? As pointed out in the article, the special treatment of Harvin, Hernandez and other stars on the team was huge contributor to a huge rift in the locker room and eventually the program's sudden demise. Then poor Urban sits out for a year for "health reasons" but suddenly, miraculously, recovers to take the Ohio State job. Right. Good luck, Columbus.

Harvin, by most accounts, has been a decent pro where his behavior is concerned. But there also have been unmistakeable signs of his Florida ways. Harvin's a great player, but he's no saint.

Nice post. I feel your frustrations about how individuals acquire information and form opinions from available resources. It is a new kind of literacy that we face in this age.

Speaking of "reading," I find it extremely interesting to look at the Vikings' treatment of the Percy Harvin situation, particularly how they speak to the press, as an illustration of their ability to make major decisions without revealing their intentions to rivals. It is very much like the art of dissimulation in statecraft--a commonly accepted form of deception throughout history.

I find Frazier to be a very straight shooter and I do not suspect that he would be capable of hiding such juicy information as the intent to trade Percy from the press. If it turns out that I am wrong I think I would respect Frazier even more, not for getting rid of Percy, but for his ability to not show his hand in public and give rivals an edge.

I tend to think that things will simmer and Percy will get signed. One thing he has done well is staying quiet through all of this. I think he will be content once we offer him decent money and an acceptable plan b at QB.

[PurpleJarl]

No doubt, but that's high expectations for anyone [/quote]



But is it? These men get paid millions upon millions of dollars to play a game which, they could retire from after a single a year and be set for life. Percy is 24 he wont even be thirty by the time his next MASSIVE contract is up. I don't care what he does once he stops playing the game, but its really sad that we have come to point were we don't even expect a man who we are giving his dreams to on a silver platter to be able to be an upstanding citizen. Not picking a fight, just a random comment about it.

So, any other trade prospects at wide receiver besides pipe dreams? Is there even a team out there that has more than 1 "#1 receiver" size wise? I can really think of one.[/quote]


[/quote]

Not really but thanks for that awesome gif! While he (Above) may not personally feel that way my point is many people consider this kinda of behavior tolerable when we would be shocked he wasn't fired in any other type of job. My only point was its interesting that We hold those who can have everything to a much lower moral & ethical standard than everyone else who cant. It really is an interesting societal perspective.

[VikingLord]

Harvin, by most accounts, has been a decent pro where his behavior is concerned. But there also have been unmistakeable signs of his Florida ways. Harvin's a great player, but he's no saint.

Just for the record, I don't get worked up over tweets...

You seem to out-weight Harvin's days at Florida when forming your opinion of his character issues. To that I'd just like to say:

- I think all of us did or didn't do things in our past that we hope do not define who we are today
- Whatever Harvin and his compatriots in the Florida program "got away" with, they only got away with it because the program, and maybe more specifically, the head coach, let them. This directly relates to the maturity issue. If the authority figures allow things to happen, the people under them will take advantage of that. Harvin might not have been a child in the strict sense of that term while at Florida, but he only took what he was given. There is no indication that similar deference is given by Frazier (or by Childress, for that matter), so it's not as simple as drawing a line between then and now and saying Harvin is going to do the same thing in both situations. Harvin is a legit adult now with a ton of money and could probably walk away from the game if he chose, and the guys in charge are unlikely to impressed by Harvin or as inclined to believe the overall success of the team depends on him playing. I think this is even more true watching how the Vikings finished the season without Percy contributing at all. So if Harvin really is a petulant whiner who thinks he's entitled to unique treatment, I'd imagine he's in for a rude awakening, be that with the Vikings or any other team he could entertain being shipped to at this point.

[chicagopurple]

ANY trade that leads to a promising new QB, that doesnt involve AP, is OK with me..........