Stadium thread

[J. Kapp 11]

Only thing I can say is that I don't know if 0.15% is what's on the table for the Vikings.

Target Field came in at $412 million, which is less than half of the latest Vikings stadium proposal of about $865 million (but holy crap ... $412 MM isn't bad for a park voted #1 sports stadium in the USA by ESPN The Magazine). So I'd guess the sales tax would increase proportionately.

Even if it were 0.5%, that doesn't seem outrageous to me. But again, I don't live in the area.

What I hate is when option-type sales taxes become permanent. About 11 years ago, Polk County in Iowa, where I live, approved a 1% sales-tax hike for 10 years to improve county schools. It worked great ... lots of shiny new schools were built. But after the 10 years were up, they decided to just make it permanent, even though I don't think the schools are getting the money anymore. It seems way more fair to me to increase the sales tax for only as long as it takes to pay for the funded item, then remove it. But that's not how our entitlement society seems to work.

[Ronder]

The university of MN has called a press conference for 4 p.m. at TCF Bank Stadium about the Stadium situation

[purple guy]

That'll be funny if these pussies have play outside. Heck, they quit when they were in the warm dome in Detroit. That'll be a laugher if they have to play at the Gophers new stadium, hell, just let the Gophs play, probably wouldnt be any worse.

[glg]

That'll be funny if these pussies have play outside. Heck, they quit when they were in the warm dome in Detroit. That'll be a laugher if they have to play at the Gophers new stadium, hell, just let the Gophs play, probably wouldnt be any worse.

We get it, you're pissed after that. Chill out.

[thatguy]

That'll be funny if these pussies have play outside. Heck, they quit when they were in the warm dome in Detroit. That'll be a laugher if they have to play at the Gophers new stadium, hell, just let the Gophs play, probably wouldnt be any worse.

How bout this...if the Vikes beat the Bears this Monday...you don't say a bad word about 'em for the rest of the season.

[cthusky]

"The Deflated Season"

This year has bee a struggle for the Vikes. That fact is nothing to deny. Now shortly after a few legislators say there is little chance of a new stadium, the dome deflates. What a metaphor for the season.

Now as i am watching the Monday night game on ESPN - I see a Houston Texans expansion team [because the Houston Oilers left] playing the Baltimore Ravens [the real Cleveland Browns] playing on Monday night. Does anyone else see the irony in this?

It has been proven time and time again, cities and states do not pony up for a new stadium and then they lose their team. Only later to decide the lost revenues, lost taxes, and lost dollars to local charities are important. Then each state or local government begins a fight to gain a franchise back. After which a struggle to gain mediocrity begins, while your fleeing franchise wins championships. [Look in everyone's backyard for example-- MN Wild [North Stars] and MN Timberwolves [Lakers]. Come on - the stadium needs to be built. MN can not lose the face of the state.

I honestly hope this was not to political - I would like to hear some responses. If so, I understand if you take me off for a week and my apologies.

Oh and by the way -- Do the smart guys running the KFAN post game show still want Tavaris as a the starting QB or do they now want Webb. Whose bandwagon are they on tonight? I hope they have realized that Farve always was the best option all season. I am sure they will say that Farve was the best, but not to long ago ole CC wanted Farve benched and that Childress was gutless. How about benching Cory Cove from the postgame show!

I basically think that this poster is right. Look at the "real" Baltimore Colts and the "real" Cleveland Browns. They were supposed to be fixtures too, but they moved. Then the cities scrambled to build a new stadium, and worked like crazy to get another team.

Let's face it: having an NFL team is about more than taxes, jobs, charities, etc. There is an important payoff in being an NFL city, a prestige that comes with having a team with the legacy of the Vikings. This is a city known for the Vikings.

Sorry, but without the Vikings, the twin cities will be only a little fancier version of Fargo-Morehead.

[thatguy]

The origninal stadium Plan was ~900 Million. Wilf was offering to pay 250 million of that. So thats ~650 million the state has to come up with which they will make back in a year or 2.

Not to mention the other events that can be held there(assuming its Domed or retractable roof) that brings revenue into the city like NCAA tourneys, Bowl Games, Concerts, Conventions, etc.

And it helps the city more than just the money brought in in said stadium.
You have tourists/other fans/other teams that come in for them events event spend money in hotels, restaraunts, etc in the state.

So for the state its guaranteed to make that 650 million back and possible make double or triple that amount back in the long run.

That's the idea...but when you're a politician...apparently you only think short-term (aka, the next 3-5 years). But you are absolutely right...the positive FAR outweighs the cost of the stadium.

[mondry]

That's the idea...but when you're a politician...apparently you only think short-term (aka, the next 3-5 years). But you are absolutely right...the positive FAR outweighs the cost of the stadium.

That is a major problem in this country right now IMO, they only think short term because they are only elected for the short term, in some cases like the presidency you only get 2 terms or 8 years max by rule, obviously pros and cons to any set up though, don't want the same jerk for 50 years either.

That is why I think a new governor will at least help in this situation of building a new stadium, it'd be early in a term and still see the benefit while they're around.

It's obviously worth it to build a new stadium, even with publicly funded money, otherwise no one would EVER build a new stadium, right? You don't have to look much further than the twins to see how a new stadium did for that fan base and the area, not to mention the team.

[Cliff]

What I hate is when option-type sales taxes become permanent. About 11 years ago, Polk County in Iowa, where I live, approved a 1% sales-tax hike for 10 years to improve county schools. It worked great ... lots of shiny new schools were built. But after the 10 years were up, they decided to just make it permanent, even though I don't think the schools are getting the money anymore. It seems way more fair to me to increase the sales tax for only as long as it takes to pay for the funded item, then remove it. But that's not how our entitlement society seems to work.

This kind of thing being common place is why so many people appose tax increases of nearly any kind.

Taxes are increased for a specific purpose (like funding a war in the case of income tax) and then they're never reversed once that purpose is fulfilled. People simply get used to paying the tax over a period of time and then they slip in legislation to keep it.

[CCthebest]

Look, Minnesota got rid of the North Stars, which broke my heart. That was supposedly the end of hockey in MN. Now they have the Wild. I dont care if LA had 5 NFL teams, it means nothing. If the money and stadium are there Wilf will move. And Wilf is the only one who knows. Opions are like, well, everyone has one.

[BGM]

Look, Minnesota got rid of the North Stars, which broke my heart. That was supposedly the end of hockey in MN. Now they have the Wild. I dont care if LA had 5 NFL teams, it means nothing. If the money and stadium are there Wilf will move. And Wilf is the only one who knows. Opions are like, well, everyone has one.

Minnesota did not get rid of the North Stars. Norm Green stole them from Minnesota and transplanted them to Texas. Hockey in Texas? Seriously? I am still angry about that one.

[thatguy]

Look, Minnesota got rid of the North Stars, which broke my heart. That was supposedly the end of hockey in MN. Now they have the Wild. I dont care if LA had 5 NFL teams, it means nothing. If the money and stadium are there Wilf will move. And Wilf is the only one who knows. Opions are like, well, everyone has one.

This isn't an attack on you...it's for everyone for the last time.

While you never know what can happen. WILF HAS PROMISED MINNESOTANS THAT HE WILL NEVER MOVE THE TEAM...The only way that the team moves is if he sells them to someone who will...

[dkoby]

This isn't an attack on you...it's for everyone for the last time.

While you never know what can happen. WILF HAS PROMISED MINNESOTANS THAT HE WILL NEVER MOVE THE TEAM...The only way that the team moves is if he sells them to someone who will...

He also said that Brad Childress was his coach and gave him a contract. Just because he said it doesn't mean it's true. These guys are like political leaders, they say what they are suppose to say, until they get backed into a corner, then they say they had no choice.
Not saying he will, but what Wilf says means nothing.

[thatguy]

He also said that Brad Childress was his coach and gave him a contract. Just because he said it doesn't mean it's true. These guys are like political leaders, they say what they are suppose to say, until they get backed into a corner, then they say they had no choice.
Not saying he will, but what Wilf says means nothing.

I guarantee you that it's more cost-effective for him to sell the team rather than move it.

[HornedMessiah]

I'm really excited at what could potentially come from this upcoming MFN game at TCF, as far as getting a new open-air stadium. The big argument against a roofless stadium is of course that a lot of people wouldn't go to a winter weather game. This game has a BIG chance to change that perception. We've been given a very strange gift in a way, and I would love to see a full and happy crowd enjoying the game despite below freezing temps and maybe other winter elements.

Even though it shouldn't matter, I realize the performance of the team and outcome of the game are going to influence the whole experience for people but I would think though that most people would be able to set aside a possible crappy showing from the Vikes and acknowledge that watching a game outside wasn't as bad as some would lead you to believe. People did it all the time back in the old days and the team itself was known for playing, and playing well, in the bitter cold and snow. People have gotten soft and forgotten where they live. This kind of weather is a huge part of the culture of the entire region and the voting public needs to realize/be reminded that it doesn't take a whole lot of effort to dress warm and prepare for the experience. You already live here so obviously you tolerate the cold on some level, all it takes is layering up with the winter clothes you already have and the whole experience will be great. Unique too.

It also lowers the price tag, by a pretty significant chunk if I remember correctly (compared to a "dome" with retractable roof). Something important to understand is that a modern outdoor stadium built to handle our winters would likely be a very welcoming place. It won't be fully exposed to the elements like the Old Met and it will be even better than what the Gophers have now at TCF. The concourse will either be partially indoors or warmed by giant super-heated radiators (these could also go under seating and overhanging areas). They would still probably spend like half a billion on the place so you can be sure it would have all kinds of neat stuff to make the cold games a fun experience. Let's not also forget, most of the games will be played in the fall. Barely any snow or sub-zero temps then, and fall here can sometimes be the most perfect time of year. People who shoot down the idea of an outdoor stadium act like we'll be playing every single game in winter-like conditions, which is completely absurd!

One thing we'll lose when we get a new stadium, roof or no roof, is the loud atmosphere of the dome. Some sports media person (maybe Aikmen during the game in Detroit) said that the newer "domes" aren't as loud as old style ones like the Metrodome. They're not even really domes, they're just huge sheds. So if we lose that advantage, let's give ourselves a new/old one. Bring back the winter aura of the pre-dome team. The Packers and Bears do it, why not the Vikings? Show 'em you're tougher than them. That's what this game is all about, isn't it?