Vikings Message Board.Com

J. Kapp 11 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 20, 2019 10:54 pm

Bowhunting Viking wrote: ↑Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:01 pm Ok , this post is not gospel.. it's not a prophecy and not a 100 % guarantee. What it is is an opinion from a very intelligent, informed, knowledgeable person who truly is in a position to give this opinion because of prior experience involved in this situation. And for me it is a reason to be excited , optimistic and look forward to the upcoming season.
It didn't come from a reporter , a blog writer, an analyst or any type of media member.
This came directly from a retired NFL center who can give this opinion probably better than anyone. He was drafted by the Broncos BY Mike Shanahan and started there as Cutlers QB, played in the Shanahan system, which is basically Kubiaks. When Josh McDaniels took over as head coach, he was then signed by Shanahan again when he became the coach of the Skins , and played there until he retired before last season, still playing under Kyle Shanahan. He was RG3s QB.. wont tell u the majority of the teams opinion about him and the way Snyder doted over him. Then he became Cousins center for all but Kirk's final season.
Anyway, according to him, he feels with the new system, it will in fact be a much better fit for the O lineman we have and the weapons in the skilled positions. He also believes that Cousins , from recent conversations as he still is in touch, is A. Much more comfortable and confident in the system and the Stef as O.C. and Kubiak being there. And B. Is so competitive that he wants to erase all doubt he created last year. Sounds like from what he has heard this offense is already starting to "feel it" and think they have something special brewing.
I hope this is all correct. I know it's just a retired players opinion, but at only a 2nd year removed, and having the experience in the offensive system we will be running, and being Cousins Line general for those 2 seasons, I'm feeling alot better about things than if he would have said Man you guys are in trouble.
As I said.. nothing is certain. But when i hear from him, i tend to listen and believe alot more than some media "expert".
Gives me a ray of hope.

I love hearing this. Thanks for posting.

It's been my belief since the hiring of Kubiak that our offense was going to go a drastically different direction. When you talk about the system being a better fit for the offensive linemen we have, this is something I've been speculating for some time now. When we go and get Josh Kline (experience in zone blocking), Garrett Bradbury, Drew Samia, etc., it's obvious to me that Kubiak and Stefanski are looking for a certain type of lineman with certain athletic qualities. And Kubiak, as I have mentioned endlessly, has a reputation and a proven track record for doing great things with average talent at quarterback. My belief is that Kirk Cousins is above average, so that's a reason for optimism.

To hear an ex-NFL lineman who played for Kubiak say this kind of thing makes me feel a lot better about the upcoming season.

Bowhunting Viking wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:40 am

J. Kapp 11 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 20, 2019 10:54 pm
I love hearing this. Thanks for posting.

It's been my belief since the hiring of Kubiak that our offense was going to go a drastically different direction. When you talk about the system being a better fit for the offensive linemen we have, this is something I've been speculating for some time now. When we go and get Josh Kline (experience in zone blocking), Garrett Bradbury, Drew Samia, etc., it's obvious to me that Kubiak and Stefanski are looking for a certain type of lineman with certain athletic qualities. And Kubiak, as I have mentioned endlessly, has a reputation and a proven track record for doing great things with average talent at quarterback. My belief is that Kirk Cousins is above average, so that's a reason for optimism.

To hear an ex-NFL lineman who played for Kubiak say this kind of thing makes me feel a lot better about the upcoming season.

Kapp it sure made my evening after we talked and he shared this with me.
He himself was a on the smaller side , well compared to his teammate and one of his best friends Trent Williams, in Washinton. But you could see the sparkle in his eyes when he talked about playing in the zone scheme. He also ran it in college at Bowling Green so he knew it well.
We talked about the current Vikes line and as I said, he feels this will really be a boost to their effectiveness as a line as a whole. He said it's all about speed and timing, and he feels we really so have the right personnel to be successful.
It was also great to hear him talking about Cousins state of mind right now . He said in Wash Kirk was always upright because Daniel Snyder was so on love with RG3 he looked at Kirk as the red headed stepchild, and Gruden never really totally backed him since he wasnt his pick. He gave me some specific instances to prove it, but I will keep those between he and I. But Cousins never really felt comfortable there as far as being truly wanted, and being handed the leadership of the team.
Now he feels more confident that the owners, coach and GM trust him and want him there.
He said I know alot of fans are hating on him for last season, but I think that with his comfort level now, his happiness and fit in this system, and the competitive fire he has, I think the fans and the league are gonna get a real big suprise this season.
He said that Kirk is first and foremost an amazing guy. He did laugh and say he gets a little corny when he gets wound up sometimes lol, but he is a VERY talented QB and has the potential , with tools and the organization he is now in, to really take this team deep.
I told him he really made me excited about this upcoming season and hope he is correct.
It's pretty easy to get pumped when the guy telling u this was the guy snapping our QB the ball every play, and making all the line calls and adjustments. And played in the exact system we will be running.
I talked to his brother at work yesterday and he said Kory told me to see if I still had the big #### eating grin on my face like I did after we talked. Lol.
He knows how bad I want us to succeed. It was a fun conversation. Cool to hear alot of the tidbits about certain players and teams of the league. It's a whole different world than us regular guys live. Its mind boggling. Alot of it good, but alot of bad and strange stuff too. Gives u a different perspective on some of the guys.
Oh yeah, on a cool note. He told me Linvel is one of the hardest guys to try and block in the NFL. He said the zone system is perfect against guys like him. Trying to move him one on one is almost impossible. His exact words were " it's like coming off the snap and then trying to push the team bus where you want it to go". Said hes a beast, but a real cool guy to play against.

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:23 am

Bowhunting Viking wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:40 am

Kapp it sure made my evening after we talked and he shared this with me.
He himself was a on the smaller side , well compared to his teammate and one of his best friends Trent Williams, in Washinton. But you could see the sparkle in his eyes when he talked about playing in the zone scheme. He also ran it in college at Bowling Green so he knew it well.
We talked about the current Vikes line and as I said, he feels this will really be a boost to their effectiveness as a line as a whole. He said it's all about speed and timing, and he feels we really so have the right personnel to be successful.
It was also great to hear him talking about Cousins state of mind right now . He said in Wash Kirk was always upright because Daniel Snyder was so on love with RG3 he looked at Kirk as the red headed stepchild, and Gruden never really totally backed him since he wasnt his pick. He gave me some specific instances to prove it, but I will keep those between he and I. But Cousins never really felt comfortable there as far as being truly wanted, and being handed the leadership of the team.
Now he feels more confident that the owners, coach and GM trust him and want him there.
He said I know alot of fans are hating on him for last season, but I think that with his comfort level now, his happiness and fit in this system, and the competitive fire he has, I think the fans and the league are gonna get a real big suprise this season.
He said that Kirk is first and foremost an amazing guy. He did laugh and say he gets a little corny when he gets wound up sometimes lol, but he is a VERY talented QB and has the potential , with tools and the organization he is now in, to really take this team deep.
I told him he really made me excited about this upcoming season and hope he is correct.
It's pretty easy to get pumped when the guy telling u this was the guy snapping our QB the ball every play, and making all the line calls and adjustments. And played in the exact system we will be running.
I talked to his brother at work yesterday and he said Kory told me to see if I still had the big #### eating grin on my face like I did after we talked. Lol.
He knows how bad I want us to succeed. It was a fun conversation. Cool to hear alot of the tidbits about certain players and teams of the league. It's a whole different world than us regular guys live. Its mind boggling. Alot of it good, but alot of bad and strange stuff too. Gives u a different perspective on some of the guys.
Oh yeah, on a cool note. He told me Linvel is one of the hardest guys to try and block in the NFL. He said the zone system is perfect against guys like him. Trying to move him one on one is almost impossible. His exact words were " it's like coming off the snap and then trying to push the team bus where you want it to go". Said hes a beast, but a real cool guy to play against.

This is all I really wanted. Someone to make the argument Cousins isn't just "not the problem", but he is a guy who will help us win a Super Bowl.

Instead of excuses for why he failed, reasons for why he will succeed.

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:23 am

Bowhunting Viking wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:40 am

Kapp it sure made my evening after we talked and he shared this with me.
He himself was a on the smaller side , well compared to his teammate and one of his best friends Trent Williams, in Washinton. But you could see the sparkle in his eyes when he talked about playing in the zone scheme. He also ran it in college at Bowling Green so he knew it well.
We talked about the current Vikes line and as I said, he feels this will really be a boost to their effectiveness as a line as a whole. He said it's all about speed and timing, and he feels we really so have the right personnel to be successful.
It was also great to hear him talking about Cousins state of mind right now . He said in Wash Kirk was always upright because Daniel Snyder was so on love with RG3 he looked at Kirk as the red headed stepchild, and Gruden never really totally backed him since he wasnt his pick. He gave me some specific instances to prove it, but I will keep those between he and I. But Cousins never really felt comfortable there as far as being truly wanted, and being handed the leadership of the team.
Now he feels more confident that the owners, coach and GM trust him and want him there.
He said I know alot of fans are hating on him for last season, but I think that with his comfort level now, his happiness and fit in this system, and the competitive fire he has, I think the fans and the league are gonna get a real big suprise this season.
He said that Kirk is first and foremost an amazing guy. He did laugh and say he gets a little corny when he gets wound up sometimes lol, but he is a VERY talented QB and has the potential , with tools and the organization he is now in, to really take this team deep.
I told him he really made me excited about this upcoming season and hope he is correct.
It's pretty easy to get pumped when the guy telling u this was the guy snapping our QB the ball every play, and making all the line calls and adjustments. And played in the exact system we will be running.
I talked to his brother at work yesterday and he said Kory told me to see if I still had the big #### eating grin on my face like I did after we talked. Lol.
He knows how bad I want us to succeed. It was a fun conversation. Cool to hear alot of the tidbits about certain players and teams of the league. It's a whole different world than us regular guys live. Its mind boggling. Alot of it good, but alot of bad and strange stuff too. Gives u a different perspective on some of the guys.
Oh yeah, on a cool note. He told me Linvel is one of the hardest guys to try and block in the NFL. He said the zone system is perfect against guys like him. Trying to move him one on one is almost impossible. His exact words were " it's like coming off the snap and then trying to push the team bus where you want it to go". Said hes a beast, but a real cool guy to play against.

This is all I really wanted. Someone to make the argument Cousins isn't just "not the problem", but he is a guy who will help us win a Super Bowl.

Instead of excuses for why he failed, reasons for why he will succeed.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:24 am

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:23 am
This is all I really wanted. Someone to make the argument Cousins isn't just "not the problem", but he is a guy who will help us win a Super Bowl.

Instead of excuses for why he failed, reasons for why he will succeed.

So you needed someone on here to "convince" you he will win? That's what you've been "looking for"? Because there were quite a few posts all over this board saying from multiple people including myself saying "Cousins will do this and Kubiak will bring that". But you've had to argue pretty much every one of them. So I guess that's what I dont get but it's whatever. Nobody is going to know anything until the season gets here regardless

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:26 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:24 am

So you needed someone on here to "convince" you he will win? That's what you've been "looking for"? Because there were quite a few posts all over this board saying from multiple people including myself saying "Cousins will do this and Kubiak will bring that". But you've had to argue pretty much every one of them. So I guess that's what I dont get but it's whatever. Nobody is going to know anything until the season gets here regardless

People argued things will get better, but there was no one willing to say it would get good enough that we would compete for a SB.

It was like people's expectations had gone from Cousins being the missing piece to the SB in 2018, to "we can make the playoffs with him, because of the changes we made" in 2019. It is depressing.

Argue that he will be the reason we win, not that he won't be the reason we lose.

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:41 pm

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:26 pm
People argued things will get better, but there was no one willing to say it would get good enough that we would compete for a SB.

It was like people's expectations had gone from Cousins being the missing piece to the SB in 2018, to "we can make the playoffs with him, because of the changes we made" in 2019. It is depressing.

Argue that he will be the reason we win, not that he won't be the reason we lose.

I personally have not seen anyone say they were just happy with making the playoffs and not the SB. That's what every single fan wants on here. It's just when you live in the negative, it's hard to ever see the positive. Nobody said getting to the playoffs was good enough. But last I checked you have to get to the playoffs to get to the SB. But either way, people argued things would get better.....well.... isnt a SB better? Just because they didnt specify what it was doesnt mean anyone was happy with just making the playoffs and that's it. That's just you putting words into others mouths. I believe a ton of guys on here have talked up Cousins and how they think he can win this year and so on and you're the one that attacks them with the "his record" comments.

Whether someone is talking about his passing ability or about him picking his nose, you argue it. But then want to sit on here saying that the rest of the board is depressing when you literally argue every possible statement you can when someone posts about them liking Cousins. What's depressing is you, not the rest of the board. The rest of the board are the guys backing our QB and have expressed a million different things they like about him, this new system, how the offense is going to look, Kubiak/Stefanski, what we can do in the postseason, etc. But you're the only arguing all those points with how many different members now? 6? 7? But the rest of the board is whats depressing? You might want to look into the mirror man. I respect you as a fan because I dont feel like you're on here just to complain like some were in the past. But nobody can say the "C word" without you flipping a lid and telling them they are wrong. I'm not saying we cant criticize Cousins but criticizing him for something he did wrong is one thing. Criticizing him for everything he does including wiping his as# with the wrong hand is another.

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 3:31 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:41 pm

I personally have not seen anyone say they were just happy with making the playoffs and not the SB. That's what every single fan wants on here. It's just when you live in the negative, it's hard to ever see the positive. Nobody said getting to the playoffs was good enough. But last I checked you have to get to the playoffs to get to the SB. But either way, people argued things would get better.....well.... isnt a SB better? Just because they didnt specify what it was doesnt mean anyone was happy with just making the playoffs and that's it. That's just you putting words into others mouths. I believe a ton of guys on here have talked up Cousins and how they think he can win this year and so on and you're the one that attacks them with the "his record" comments.

Whether someone is talking about his passing ability or about him picking his nose, you argue it. But then want to sit on here saying that the rest of the board is depressing when you literally argue every possible statement you can when someone posts about them liking Cousins. What's depressing is you, not the rest of the board. The rest of the board are the guys backing our QB and have expressed a million different things they like about him, this new system, how the offense is going to look, Kubiak/Stefanski, what we can do in the postseason, etc. But you're the only arguing all those points with how many different members now? 6? 7? But the rest of the board is whats depressing? You might want to look into the mirror man. I respect you as a fan because I dont feel like you're on here just to complain like some were in the past. But nobody can say the "C word" without you flipping a lid and telling them they are wrong. I'm not saying we cant criticize Cousins but criticizing him for something he did wrong is one thing. Criticizing him for everything he does including wiping his as# with the wrong hand is another.

I didn’t criticize him for wiping his butt, I criticized him for his play dropping against better teams, in the 4th of close games, on 3rd down, and I criticized his propensity for turnovers as things that have kept his teams from winning, particularly last year’s team.

Instead of arguing that those things will get better this season (something I believe could happen), I get pages of people changing the argument, blaming bad luck, or people bending over backwards to prove that these stats don’t matter. Worse, is the people who argue the QB doesn’t have a huge impact on wins. That feels like giving up to me, which like I said, is depressing.

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 3:31 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:41 pm

I personally have not seen anyone say they were just happy with making the playoffs and not the SB. That's what every single fan wants on here. It's just when you live in the negative, it's hard to ever see the positive. Nobody said getting to the playoffs was good enough. But last I checked you have to get to the playoffs to get to the SB. But either way, people argued things would get better.....well.... isnt a SB better? Just because they didnt specify what it was doesnt mean anyone was happy with just making the playoffs and that's it. That's just you putting words into others mouths. I believe a ton of guys on here have talked up Cousins and how they think he can win this year and so on and you're the one that attacks them with the "his record" comments.

Whether someone is talking about his passing ability or about him picking his nose, you argue it. But then want to sit on here saying that the rest of the board is depressing when you literally argue every possible statement you can when someone posts about them liking Cousins. What's depressing is you, not the rest of the board. The rest of the board are the guys backing our QB and have expressed a million different things they like about him, this new system, how the offense is going to look, Kubiak/Stefanski, what we can do in the postseason, etc. But you're the only arguing all those points with how many different members now? 6? 7? But the rest of the board is whats depressing? You might want to look into the mirror man. I respect you as a fan because I dont feel like you're on here just to complain like some were in the past. But nobody can say the "C word" without you flipping a lid and telling them they are wrong. I'm not saying we cant criticize Cousins but criticizing him for something he did wrong is one thing. Criticizing him for everything he does including wiping his as# with the wrong hand is another.

I didn’t criticize him for wiping his butt, I criticized him for his play dropping against better teams, in the 4th of close games, on 3rd down, and I criticized his propensity for turnovers as things that have kept his teams from winning, particularly last year’s team.

Instead of arguing that those things will get better this season (something I believe could happen), I get pages of people changing the argument, blaming bad luck, or people bending over backwards to prove that these stats don’t matter. Worse, is the people who argue the QB doesn’t have a huge impact on wins. That feels like giving up to me, which like I said, is depressing.

Raptorman wrote: ↑Sat Jun 22, 2019 11:38 am Maybe this will make things a little clearer. Of course, maybe it will muddy the waters even more.

2000-2004 Comparison of 3 QB's. So Believe it or not, statistically, Culpepper was better than Brady those 5 years. Yet Brady won 3 Super Bowls during that time period. Why? If QB play is all that it's cracked up to be, why did the Vikings and the Packers not even make it to the Big game during those years?

Code: Select all

	Passing Per Game					Passing 2000-2004						
Player	        Cmp	Att	Yds	TD	Int	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	Int	Rate
Tom Brady	19.4	31.5	217.6	1.5	0.8	1243	2018	61.6	13925	97	52	87.5
D. Culpepper	21.1	32.8	254.8	1.8	1.0	1539	2391	64.4	18598	129	74	93.2
Brett Favre*	20.6	33.2	235.5	1.8	1.1	1647	2652	62.1	18840	141	85	87.8

What did NE have that the Packers and Vikings didn't have? Ummmm..... I wonder. Could it be that Brady had a defense that gave up less than 19 points per game during the regular season? The best defense Culpepper had was 23rd in ppg. 23rd.

Code: Select all

Player	      Games	Wins	Losses	Ties	PPG	SB Wins
Tom Brady	64	48	14	0	18.2      3
D. Culpepper	73	36	37	0	24.4      0
Brett Favre*	80	53	27	0	20.5      0

Defense ranked ppg 2000-2004

Code: Select all

Patriots.  17, 6, 17,  1,  2.   Average  8.6
Packers    14, 5, 12, 11, 23.   Average 13.0
Vikings    24 26, 30, 23, 26.   Average 25.8

So please, keep thinking that Brady is such a great freaking QB that NE couldn't win without him and that Cousins and our QB's are the reason for not getting back to the Super Bowl. The average Vikings defense in ppg since their last appearance in the Super Bowl and Zimmer being hired is 17. In that time period, 37 years, the Vikings defense was a top 10 defense in PPG 6 times. Since Zimmer has been here, 5 years, they have been a top 10 team 4 of those, on the one that they weren't they were 11.

So Yes, I am optimistic about my team's chances. And yes, the QB does matter. But not as much as people want to push and believe.

Raptorman wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 5:11 pm In the last 3 years, there have been 566 games where at least one team was held to 19 points or less. That team that was held to 19 points or less lost 83% of the time.

Raptorman wrote: ↑Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:16 am

StumpHunter wrote: ↑Fri Jun 21, 2019 3:31 pm

I didn’t criticize him for wiping his butt, I criticized him for his play dropping against better teams, in the 4th of close games, on 3rd down, and I criticized his propensity for turnovers as things that have kept his teams from winning, particularly last year’s team.

Instead of arguing that those things will get better this season (something I believe could happen), I get pages of people changing the argument, blaming bad luck, or people bending over backwards to prove that these stats don’t matter. Worse, is the people who argue the QB doesn’t have a huge impact on wins. That feels like giving up to me, which like I said, is depressing.

IF QB play has such a huge impact on wins. Why haven't the Packers, with one the arguably best QB's to ever play the game only been able to win one Super Bowl during his stellar career? What about Drew Brees? He's been a top QB or years. One SB. And I would argue that Peyton Manning was a better QB than Rodgers or Brady. And look how many SB's he has. Look, I'm not saying nor have I ever said that the QB isn't important. He is just not as important as most people think. What you need is a good QB that doesn't make stupid plays, and a defense to help him out.(Think NE. And, Brady is good, just not as good as everyone believes) NO QB ever wins a game by himself.