Ponder: The Answer?

[Purple bruise]

Ponder on KFAN: http://www.kfan.com/player/?station=KFX ... d=22887537

[headless_norseman]

There just isn't anyone in the mid rounds in such a weak draft for QB's, especially to stick right in at the #2 spot. We're under the cap, so they might look for someone to fill that spot for 1-2 years.

[Eli]

There just isn't anyone in the mid rounds in such a weak draft for QB's, especially to stick right in at the #2 spot. We're under the cap, so they might look for someone to fill that spot for 1-2 years.

So that's even more reason to sign a veteran FA and not try to fill the #2 spot from the draft. Draft a QB later, somewhere in rounds 5 to 7, and see if he develops.

[PacificNorseWest]

So that's even more reason to sign a veteran FA and not try to fill the #2 spot from the draft. Draft a QB later, somewhere in rounds 5 to 7, and see if he develops.

I think Tyler Wilson falls to the mid rounds and is someone I would love to see Minnesota go after. I also believe that that shouldn't slow them from pursuing a veteran QB as well. It never hurts to have competition for that backup spot and having a veteran in this particular position is group is obviously a plus.

Minnesota probably already has the heads up on Wilson anyway, considering they employ two Razorback receivers, so it may not even be a surprise to see him go to the Vikings in the 3rd round. If they don't take him there then they probably didn't like what they saw. I do though.

[mansquatch]

I'm against a big name FA QB. Why does anyone think Alex Smith would be better than Ponder with our group of WR? I think Smith is a case where his team acquired solid skill players to put aroudn him and that made him a whole lote better. (We didn't hear his name much before those guys blossomed) Why would we think he'd be good with our group of WR?

I think a mid to late round backup is a sound plan.

[Mothman]

The best way to go might be to bring in a backup with NFL experience (Moore, Thigpen, someone like that... Alex Smith isn't likely to want a backup job or be available at a backup price) and, depending on just how good they feel about MBT's future prospects, to draft a QB in the mid-to-late rounds.

If they're truly nervous about Ponder, maybe they draft a QB as high as the second or third round.

[mansquatch]

I do not think they are that nervous about him, but I could be wrong. The guy has had some terrible games, but he has also had very good games. I just have to believe that the coaching staff understands even better than we do that his WR basically gave him zero margin to work with. When Harvin went down there was basically a double covered KR and a bunch of guys who are career 3rd stringers or injured (or both.) to throw to. Not exactly a recipe for success. The fact that Ponder got better within that environment is an underestimated positive, IMO. How many 2nd year QBs are going to get better throwing to that kind of talent?

Aside from my conjecture, I just do not see a high value back up being worth the cap space. I know people on here love Rosenfels and all of that, but they have to understand that a team rebuilding does not pay an aging back up veteran minimum money to basically sit on the bench. That type of player isn’t going to do anything for the team except take up cap space. For the same reason, I do not see them signing any “name” backup to come in here. I think they’ll take their chances in the draft if they take it at all. The reality is why would Jason Cambell or one of the others be an improvement over Ponder on the Vikings? I don’t think they would be, IMO, the FO probably thinks that the worst case is that Ponder becomes one of those guys. So why add another one? FWIW, I think the reason the Bears paid JC all that money was because they felt their FA signings would put them over the top and he was the insurance policy. How Mike Tice thought that OL would hold up in the playoffs, let alone the regular season is beyond me. Really makes you question his legitimacy as a coach…

The Webb situation is also interesting. On the surface it looks like his days as a QB should be done. I get that, no argument. But I have to wonder if they really put him in a position to put his best foot forward in that playoff game? Webb would seem to be built to run the Read Option, I kind of wonder if Musgrave will have second thoughts about that. (As an aside, can you imagine Michael Vick in that kind of system?) Yes, the guy’s throws in that game were garbage, I get that, but I suspect he’d be a better passer in a more improvisational system, like the Read Option. He’d certain give a defense fits with his legs, but has to be able to strike the balance like Kaepernick. (I think the importance of Davis and Crabtree to Kaepernick cannot be overstated, just ask the Raven’s Defense) Basically my argument is that if you are going to up the talent of your WR, does that then translate to having a QB like Webb as your backup? Is he viable with better pass catchers? I have no idea, but there is no football so one can venture down the rabbit hole like this.

I still think at best they’ll put out a mid-round pick and I’d be shocked if it was any earlier than the 3rd round.

[Mothman]

Aside from my conjecture, I just do not see a high value back up being worth the cap space. I know people on here love Rosenfels and all of that, but they have to understand that a team rebuilding does not pay an aging back up veteran minimum money to basically sit on the bench. That type of player isn’t going to do anything for the team except take up cap space. For the same reason, I do not see them signing any “name” backup to come in here. I think they’ll take their chances in the draft if they take it at all. The reality is why would Jason Cambell or one of the others be an improvement over Ponder on the Vikings?

I don't think that's the question the Vikings have to ask. I'm not sure how you define a "high value backup" or a "name" backup so I'm not sure if you're excluding any experienced backup or just some. For example, in what category would you place players like Matt Moore and Tyler Thigpen? I'm not sure how much cap room a player like that would take up.

Anyway... I don't think the question about a veteran backup is necessarily "Would he be an improvement over Ponder?" but rather, "Can they win with him if Ponder gets hurt?" They were a 10-6 team last season. If they improve in other areas, would they want to start a 5th round rookie or MBT if Ponder was injured during a run to the playoffs? It depends on the particular QBs and how they're developing, of course, but having an experienced backup who won't be overwhelmed by facing an NFL defense in an elimination game isn't a bad idea. A backup QB can be a "Plan B" in case the starter doesn't work out but it's also advisable to have a player that can handle the offense well enough to give the team a chance to win if the starter is injured. That's one of the biggest lessons the Vikes should take away from that playoff loss at Lambeau: whoever the backup is, he has to be able to give them a chance to win.

The Webb situation is also interesting. On the surface it looks like his days as a QB should be done. I get that, no argument. But I have to wonder if they really put him in a position to put his best foot forward in that playoff game? Webb would seem to be built to run the Read Option, I kind of wonder if Musgrave will have second thoughts about that.

He might but I don't think he should. Installing a new "read option" offense in the week leading up to a playoff game is asking a lot, especially when the team wasn't sure which QB would be able to start. If Ponder's elbow had been good enough to go at game time, and the Vikings had spent the whole week installing plays that were specifically designed to help Webb, that would have been a problem. In the end, Webb supposedly executed well during the week and failed to execute on game day. No matter how many "read option" plays they had installed, sooner or later he was going to have to complete passes and threaten the defense through the air as well as on the ground. As you said, he had to be able to strike a balance...

[PacificNorseWest]

Moore and Thigpen would be perfect guys to bring in. Alex Smith is a big time no-go. I said this on the last page or so, but he's the same type of Q as Ponder except that it took him this many years to finally be decent. May as well let Ponder finish his development because his ceiling at this point is higher than Smith's...If he fails then you go elsewhere.

[PurpleMustReign]

I will never understand peoples infatuation with Thigpen.


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[Mothman]

I will never understand peoples infatuation with Thigpen.

Infatuation? I just think he could be a good, experienced backup for a season or two at a reasonable price.

[gobigorgohome]

Hi,

New to the forum. Have watched every game Ponder has played for the Vikes. I think they will stick with him and doom the franchise for another long period of time before they he will never lead you to where you go. 1. Get a veteran backup, Joe Webb is not nfl caliber. Try Webb for returns......

And, draft : EJ Manuel!

[headless_norseman]

So that's even more reason to sign a veteran FA and not try to fill the #2 spot from the draft. Draft a QB later, somewhere in rounds 5 to 7, and see if he develops.

Drafting a QB in those late rounds in a weak QB draft is like signing up a non drafted FA in most other drafts. It doesn't work, especially when you are looking for a #2 guy.

[headless_norseman]

Bottom line is that the front office is going with Ponder as the starter and future for next season. And if he falters or doesn't progress, then in all likelihood it's back to square one.

[Mothman]

My hope for Ponder next year is that he removes all doubt either way. I hate to be sitting here this time next year saying "Well he's ok, but I don't know." And we're stuck in mediocrity, because the FO beliefs he's done enough to keep his job.

At this point, short of throwing for 35 TDs, 4000+ yards, fewer than 10 INTs and leading the Vikes to a Super Bowl win, I wonder if Ponder could do enough next season to remove all doubt. That's not a shot at anyone. It's just that the doubt is clearly there among most of us fans and I think it would take a lot to rid us of it.

I want to see more consistency and continued improvement from Ponder. Ideally, it would be great to be able to say at the end of next season that Ponder is the right guy, the franchise QB the team needs to go all the way. I don't know if we'll get there but if it's going to happen, I think they have to seriously upgrade their outside receivers and they need to improve the pass protection too. Give him time to throw and a receiving corps that can truly get the job done and that should make assessing his skills much easier. It should also lead to more success even if Ponder doesn't get better.

While we're on the subject, Vikings reporter and Associated press contributor Brian Hall recently wrote a piece about Ponder:

Vikings' Ponder reaches pivotal third year