Stadium thread

[S197]

On the same day Minnesota Vikings owner Zigi Wilf's private plane was spotted at a Southern California airport Thursday comes this little nugget: NFL commissioner Roger Goodell recently met privately in Los Angeles with Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa to talk about, among other things, the NFL relocating to Los Angeles.

The connection: The Vikings were dealt a major blow to their stadium efforts in Minnesota this week when the House Government Operations and Elections committee rejected by a 9-6 vote a proposal for a $975 million plan to raze and rebuild the Hubert H. Humphrey Metrodome in downtown Minneapolis.

The state now has 10 more days to either revive the bill and get a stadium deal passed or risk losing the Vikings, who intimated they will not wait until 2013 to finalize a new stadium plan in Minneapolis.

"There is no next year," Vikings vice president Lester Bagley said.

http://www.dailynews.com/breakingnews/c ... -zigi-wilf

[OJVIKE]

If they go to LA as the Vikings all the people who say they won't be a fan no more are basically saying they're Minnesota fans and not Vikings fans. Correct?

For example if Minnesota ever got a team back you would become a fan of that team? Say you did continue to root for them in LA then Minnesota got a team back, would you change teams?

I don't know how many hockey fans are on this board but how many of you followed the North Stars to Dallas? Or did you stop having a team/watching hockey until you got the Wild back.

Not judging anyone, to each the own, this is just something I always wondered about any moved team. Its not just Minnesota either I've wondered the same thing about LA to STL Rams, Oilers(Titans) to Tennessee then getting the Texans, Expos/Nationals, Jets/Coyotes then Thrashers/Jets, and so on.

Name changes might be a little different story though as even though its the same players it has that expansion team feel to it.

for me its loyalty...i would be a fan of my state first.

[Raptorman]

So those of you who live in MN. This is what one of your Senators is saying about the Vikings stadium.
While this is just part of his e-mail, you can read the rest at the link.

“I remain a strong supporter of public investments that actually expand prosperity and improve economic productivity: education, early childhood, research, infrastructure, health, the environment, and workforce development. I would be willing to consider a compromise on this matter is if the debate over paying for a stadium would open up the political and policy potential of making investments in those things that would make a real difference for our future.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... formation/

[vikeinmontana]

http://www.dailynews.com/breakingnews/c ... -zigi-wilf

good. i fear the politicians and opponents of a new stadium in minnesota don't realize just how clueless they are being...

[Demi]

You've got a stadium that will create thousands of new jobs and result in a direct measurable return on investment. And he's going to bring up all this other crap that there is no real way you can measure what type of returns they have?

"Millionaires and Billionaires". And there it is. Instead of doing what is best for the state, they'll just spite the NFL. And feel better of themselves for doing it. Regardless of the actual results. Because by golly, those rich people ain't getting any money from him! Scum bag.

[vikeinmontana]

You've got a stadium that will create thousands of new jobs and result in a direct measurable return on investment. And he's going to bring up all this other crap that there is no real way you can measure what type of returns they have?

"Millionaires and Billionaires". And there it is. Instead of doing what is best for the state, they'll just spite the NFL. And feel better of themselves for doing it. Regardless of the actual results. Because by golly, those rich people ain't getting any money from him! Scum bag.

pretty much. sad really.

[CalVike]

The fools are trying real hard to kill it without a full vote. Hopefully the NFL's full force pressure at least results in a full vote of the whole house and whole senate, instead of the #### shenanigans legislators are trying to pull to mire the stadium bill in typical election year political crap and avoid letting the world know where the individual legislators stand. Trust me, I live in LA and LA will gladly take the Vikings. AEG is almost ready! The argument that LA is too interested in other things is true, but the population is high enough that it does not matter. If AEG builds a downtown stadium at LA Live, the people will come including those in "the industry" and it will become one of the most profitable NFL franchises in the country. There may be other teams in bad situations, but the NFL is done with Minnesota if they fail this session. Zygi Wilf the developer is salivating at how much profit he might make by selling out to LA interests. Remember, he's not one of us, but he has done everything in his power to build up our team as a winner and support a stadium bill this session. If this fails, he is done with us.

[CalVike]

Also, I listened to NFL VP Grubman on KFAN today. He said there is no move to expansion & that LA is for the first time viable at not one but almost two sites. He also said Minnesota has no lease for 2012. Read between the lines: this team could be gone post haste if the legislature fails. No one will watch a 3-13 lame duck so there may be little point going forward in Minnesota when this fails. The Feb. 15 deadline on relocation offers no protection in this situation, when NFL ownership fully feels Minnesota does not care about passing a stadium bill.

[Just Me]

If they go to LA as the Vikings all the people who say they won't be a fan no more are basically saying they're Minnesota fans and not Vikings fans. Correct?

For example if Minnesota ever got a team back you would become a fan of that team? Say you did continue to root for them in LA then Minnesota got a team back, would you change teams?

Not judging anyone, to each the own, this is just something I always wondered about any moved team. Its not just Minnesota either I've wondered the same thing about LA to STL Rams, Oilers(Titans) to Tennessee then getting the Texans, Expos/Nationals, Jets/Coyotes then Thrashers/Jets, and so on.

Name changes might be a little different story though as even though its the same players it has that expansion team feel to it.

It's hard to define. Not a resident of MN (ironically I never have been - I was a kid in LaCrosse, WI when Tarkenton was playing for the Vikes, and that is when I became a fan) I would still have a hard time supporting the Vikings if they moved from Minnesota. Worse, since I have no particular tie to MN other than the Vikings I highly doubt that an expansion team would "re-ignite" my interest in Minnesota Football. In my mind, it will be the end of an era if the Vikings move, and there will be no going back. Minnesota and Vikings are just two words that belong together (IMHO) and I don't forsee myself ever being a fan of the LA Vikings or the Minnesota Warriors (or whatever they choose to call them).

[TheCoolerOne]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... situation/

[dead_poet]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... situation/

Thanks for the link. It's a good summary.

[Cliff]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... situation/

Good read. I thought this comment at the bottom was interesting;

The committe that shot down the stadium earlier this week was following the rules; any large sports expenditure has to be approved by referendum.

OK.. I get that. I even approve/applaud.

But my question then becomes… “When’s the referendum?”

If this were such an urgent issue, a special referendum could be put together for sometime this summer. Before the general elections. And the Stadium bill could go forward, or not, accordingly.

I have heard no talk about scheduling that referendum.

Without the referendum, this smacks loudly of “We don’t want to vote for more taxes and more spending until after we’re re-elected in the fall.”

If the legislators pass a bill now, they’re afraid they won’t get re-elected. So they’ll stall and delay until after November. Then, it’ll be “really urgent” and cost more to build faster. But by then they won’t care because they’re safe in elected office for a couple years.

I wonder if November will be too late?

[dead_poet]

Good read. I thought this comment at the bottom was interesting;
I wonder if November will be too late?

Won't a referendum almost certainly get shot down? Isn't that why folks are trying to go go around it?

[mansquatch]

The risk is if the Vikings become more or less a Free Agent franchise. If that happens then the Legislature will get into a bidding war with other potential suitors, most likely the fiscally irresponsible folks in LA. If they can't get it done now, they will never get it done in that environment.

I'm not a fan of Pat Kesller or Dan Barrero when it comes to politics, but they hit this one right on the head:

Barrero: Does anyone look good in this? (About the polticians)
Kessler: No

That sums it up for me. They should extend the session, admit they screwed up, and get this thing done. The Vikings ownership has bent over backwards for them, it is time for them to do their jobs. There are certainly issues with how you do a stadium, but not getting it done is a total failure of leadership and I as voter will personally not have mercy on them in November if they fail in this regard. irrespective of party. I either will vote againt or not vote. They do not deserve their position if that can not at least take a stand and vote on the issue.

[Cliff]

Won't a referendum almost certainly get shot down? Isn't that why folks are trying to go go around it?

That may be right but I tend to agree with the poster's overall line of thinking. Government officials are going to want to stall anything that would raise taxes or pay large sums of public money into something until after the elections in November.