Vikings @ Dolphins post game

A forum for the hard core Minnesota Vikings fan. Discuss upcoming games, opponents, trades, draft or what ever is on the minds of Viking fans!

Moderator: Moderators

J. Kapp 11
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9856
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:57 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

Texas Vike wrote: Mon Oct 17, 2022 8:36 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote: Mon Oct 17, 2022 6:40 pm
Kevin O'Connell is just incredible. I absolutely love his attention to detail.

I've read reports that the Vikings began pre-hydrating last MONDAY for yesterday's game. They also practiced all week in sweats. All to prepare for the heat.

In the end, THEY were the fresh team, even though it was 115 degrees on their sideline, and Miami was the team cramping up. And guess what? In the fourth quarter, when fatigue was likely to become a factor, the Vikings shined.

Loving this team more every week.
I caught that about hydration and acclimating via sweats too. I think the results speak to having taken the best route w/ "sleep science" as well for their trip to London. Seems like KOC has a good team of experts around him.

Check this out:
Vikeologist™
@Vikeologist
Vikings were a league worst with a -73 point differential in the final four minutes of halves in 2021. This season they are the league's best with a +33 differential.

Credit:
@jjones9
Once again, KOC is on top of this and emphasizes the ends (and beginnings) of halves with his players. He talks all the time about the "middle 8," which is the last 4 minutes of the first half and the first 4 minutes of the second half. He believes if you win the middle 8, you have a great chance to win the game. It's all about momentum ... score just before the half and right after the half. In Miami, the Vikings won the middle 8 by 10-0. Going into the Bears game, they were 23-0 in the middle 8 (they did lose the middle 8 to the Bears 14-0). For the season, I think they're outscored their opponents 33-14. And that doesn't even account for the final 4 minutes of the game, which you have addressed.

Kevin O'Connell is so good with the details of football. And he's just a rookie with 6 games under his belt. I have no doubt the Vikings will get better as a team as time goes on. By the same token, I have even less doubt that KOC will get even better as a coach. His game management thus far has been phenomenal, and the Vikings' preparation outside the Xs and Os is second to none. As he improves his play calling and his ability to adjust (which, by the way, he did pretty well against the Dolphins), the Vikings are going to be tough.
Image
Go ahead. I dare you.
Underestimate this man.
User avatar
IIsweet
Pro Bowl Elite Player
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:02 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by IIsweet »

I too am very much impressed with KOC and his staff to this point.
I think Donatell started to make some adjustments in the game that helped preserve a victory. We had a 4 man front a lot in the 2nd half and they were able to create a lot of pressure on Teddy. Patrick Jones was great in this game, as were Hunter and Smith at creating pressure. However, We have a serious lack of speed in the secondary. It is evident. When we took a lead, we went even more into a bend but don't break defense and Miami marched down the field. I am hoping for the rapid development of Booth, Evans, Asamoah, and a return of Cine. We need that speed on the field.
Hill and Waddle were able to do pretty much as they desired against our guys.
Once Miami figured out to settle Hill down in a soft spot in the zone, it was easy pickings... unless our DL beat the OL to the QB, which was frequent. We cannot compete with the speed that they put on the field at WR and TE.
You know what though ??? we won again. 5-1 heading into the bye week. To me the playoffs are a race to 10 wins at least. We are 1/2 way there with 11 games left

***on a side note... there were a ton of purple jerseys in Miami at the game. That was awesome to see. I had a great time high fiving and fist bumping with the fans in front of me. Looked to be nearly 40-50% of the crowd. It was awesome when the Miami fans started leaving and yet the Stadium still had a ton of people in it. Even heard a Dolphin fan saying that "I am tired of seeing all these purple jerseys"!***
J. Kapp 11
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9856
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:57 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

IIsweet wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 10:22 am I too am very much impressed with KOC and his staff to this point.
I think Donatell started to make some adjustments in the game that helped preserve a victory. We had a 4 man front a lot in the 2nd half and they were able to create a lot of pressure on Teddy. Patrick Jones was great in this game, as were Hunter and Smith at creating pressure. However, We have a serious lack of speed in the secondary. It is evident. When we took a lead, we went even more into a bend but don't break defense and Miami marched down the field. I am hoping for the rapid development of Booth, Evans, Asamoah, and a return of Cine. We need that speed on the field.
Hill and Waddle were able to do pretty much as they desired against our guys.
Once Miami figured out to settle Hill down in a soft spot in the zone, it was easy pickings... unless our DL beat the OL to the QB, which was frequent. We cannot compete with the speed that they put on the field at WR and TE.
You know what though ??? we won again. 5-1 heading into the bye week. To me the playoffs are a race to 10 wins at least. We are 1/2 way there with 11 games left

***on a side note... there were a ton of purple jerseys in Miami at the game. That was awesome to see. I had a great time high fiving and fist bumping with the fans in front of me. Looked to be nearly 40-50% of the crowd. It was awesome when the Miami fans started leaving and yet the Stadium still had a ton of people in it. Even heard a Dolphin fan saying that "I am tired of seeing all these purple jerseys"!***
I didn't get to watch the game ... NFL+ Premium blacked it out (I mean, what is the point of paying for the service if you can't watch your team?). I promptly cancelled right there in the middle of the game.

But on the radio, you could tell that there were a LOT of Vikings fans in the stadium. It was especially evident on Cook's 53-yard TD run. It almost sounded on the radio like the Vikes were playing a home game!

Totally agree with you about the lack of speed. When I go to games at USB, we buy tickets from friends who have season tickets but don't go to all the games. We're directly behind the goalposts in the 40th row, which sounds a lot like the seats you had. Perfect all-22 view. Against Detroit, you could see how slow our DBs are, and the Lions' receivers aren't nearly as fast as Hill and Waddle. A lot of people bash Donatell for his scheme ... can you imagine these guys trying to play press coverage? They'd get slaughtered. So you're right, we need Booth to get healthy. We need Asamoah to get up to speed and on the field. We need Akayleb Evans to get up to speed and on the field. We need an actual slot corner. We need Cine to heal up and get on the field next year. Personnel-wise, this defense can't compete with fast teams. The Vikings HAVE to get pressure, or they get torched.

Cardinals and Kyler Murray are next. That'll be like playing against Justin Fields, only Murray is better at this stage of his career than Fields is. Later in the Bears game, I noticed that Donatell put Asamoah in the game, and his job was to spy Fields. He entered the game not long after Fields' long TD run that got called back, and Fields had less success scrambling with Asamoah spying him. Hoping Donatell does that against the Cardinals.
Image
Go ahead. I dare you.
Underestimate this man.
JJBreaksRecords
Pro Bowl Elite Player
Posts: 529
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2022 10:22 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by JJBreaksRecords »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 8:58 am
Texas Vike wrote: Mon Oct 17, 2022 8:36 pm

I caught that about hydration and acclimating via sweats too. I think the results speak to having taken the best route w/ "sleep science" as well for their trip to London. Seems like KOC has a good team of experts around him.

Check this out:
Once again, KOC is on top of this and emphasizes the ends (and beginnings) of halves with his players. He talks all the time about the "middle 8," which is the last 4 minutes of the first half and the first 4 minutes of the second half. He believes if you win the middle 8, you have a great chance to win the game. It's all about momentum ... score just before the half and right after the half. In Miami, the Vikings won the middle 8 by 10-0. Going into the Bears game, they were 23-0 in the middle 8 (they did lose the middle 8 to the Bears 14-0). For the season, I think they're outscored their opponents 33-14. And that doesn't even account for the final 4 minutes of the game, which you have addressed.

Kevin O'Connell is so good with the details of football. And he's just a rookie with 6 games under his belt. I have no doubt the Vikings will get better as a team as time goes on. By the same token, I have even less doubt that KOC will get even better as a coach. His game management thus far has been phenomenal, and the Vikings' preparation outside the Xs and Os is second to none. As he improves his play calling and his ability to adjust (which, by the way, he did pretty well against the Dolphins), the Vikings are going to be tough.
I cant figure out how to just quote a few lines. Sorry for the long post.

I agree with you about KOC. I still am not fully completely sold on the culture changing a lot, but time will tell.

I agree with your assessment of KO. And I think the best thing about him s, he has already made adjustments at be HC. He seems more comfortable, and the play calling seems a bit better than before. Once Donatell trusts his D, and can make adjustments, this team will be really clicking.
J. Kapp 11
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9856
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:57 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

JJBreaksRecords wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:23 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 8:58 am
Once again, KOC is on top of this and emphasizes the ends (and beginnings) of halves with his players. He talks all the time about the "middle 8," which is the last 4 minutes of the first half and the first 4 minutes of the second half. He believes if you win the middle 8, you have a great chance to win the game. It's all about momentum ... score just before the half and right after the half. In Miami, the Vikings won the middle 8 by 10-0. Going into the Bears game, they were 23-0 in the middle 8 (they did lose the middle 8 to the Bears 14-0). For the season, I think they're outscored their opponents 33-14. And that doesn't even account for the final 4 minutes of the game, which you have addressed.

Kevin O'Connell is so good with the details of football. And he's just a rookie with 6 games under his belt. I have no doubt the Vikings will get better as a team as time goes on. By the same token, I have even less doubt that KOC will get even better as a coach. His game management thus far has been phenomenal, and the Vikings' preparation outside the Xs and Os is second to none. As he improves his play calling and his ability to adjust (which, by the way, he did pretty well against the Dolphins), the Vikings are going to be tough.
I cant figure out how to just quote a few lines. Sorry for the long post.

I agree with you about KOC. I still am not fully completely sold on the culture changing a lot, but time will tell.

I agree with your assessment of KO. And I think the best thing about him s, he has already made adjustments at be HC. He seems more comfortable, and the play calling seems a bit better than before. Once Donatell trusts his D, and can make adjustments, this team will be really clicking.
I wish I could get you access to the Tyler Dunne article about the culture, but it's very long and behind a paywall. It's so informative, full of direct quotes from players and coaches who endured last season. Guys hated coming to work last year. The atmosphere was toxic. They arrive at work early with KOC. The camaraderie seems obvious to me. They've got each other's backs. And I mean, look at Cousins when he gets faced with adversity. Obviously the Philly game is the exception, but otherwise he's bouncing back from adversity and interceptions in ways many of us never thought possible. In the Bears game, for example, he led that 17-play game-winning drive directly following his interception. In the past, he would have melted down. This time, he helped win the game. I believe that's culture and KOC's influence.

Unfortunately, I don't think Donatell has much to work with on defense. He simply can't blitz a lot ... if he asks his slow DBs and LBs to play man, the Vikings will get killed even worse than they are. I think he adjusted against the Dolphins by finally going to a 4-man front on passing downs. Helped turn up the pressure without having to blitz a ton (I think we had 25 pressures, and 22 came without the benefit of a blitz). He also adjusted against the Bears. Right after Fields broke off that long TD run that got called back by penalty, Donatell started using Brian Asamoah to spy Fields. Hoping he does more of that against Kyler Murray in a couple of weeks.
Image
Go ahead. I dare you.
Underestimate this man.
Pondering Her Percy
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9241
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:38 am
Location: Watertown, NY

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:47 pm
JJBreaksRecords wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:23 pm

I cant figure out how to just quote a few lines. Sorry for the long post.

I agree with you about KOC. I still am not fully completely sold on the culture changing a lot, but time will tell.

I agree with your assessment of KO. And I think the best thing about him s, he has already made adjustments at be HC. He seems more comfortable, and the play calling seems a bit better than before. Once Donatell trusts his D, and can make adjustments, this team will be really clicking.
I wish I could get you access to the Tyler Dunne article about the culture, but it's very long and behind a paywall. It's so informative, full of direct quotes from players and coaches who endured last season. Guys hated coming to work last year. The atmosphere was toxic. They arrive at work early with KOC. The camaraderie seems obvious to me. They've got each other's backs. And I mean, look at Cousins when he gets faced with adversity. Obviously the Philly game is the exception, but otherwise he's bouncing back from adversity and interceptions in ways many of us never thought possible. In the Bears game, for example, he led that 17-play game-winning drive directly following his interception. In the past, he would have melted down. This time, he helped win the game. I believe that's culture and KOC's influence.

Unfortunately, I don't think Donatell has much to work with on defense. He simply can't blitz a lot ... if he asks his slow DBs and LBs to play man, the Vikings will get killed even worse than they are. I think he adjusted against the Dolphins by finally going to a 4-man front on passing downs. Helped turn up the pressure without having to blitz a ton (I think we had 25 pressures, and 22 came without the benefit of a blitz). He also adjusted against the Bears. Right after Fields broke off that long TD run that got called back by penalty, Donatell started using Brian Asamoah to spy Fields. Hoping he does more of that against Kyler Murray in a couple of weeks.
Yeah I've been noticing Asamoah out there more and more which I think is a good thing. It's weird, Hicks doesnt fair well in PFF but he 100% has a nose for the ball. He seems like he's always right there making plays. But I get that he definitely does lack sideline to sideline speed which is where Asamoah comes in.

I also think the more they allow Hunter to have his hand in the dirt, the better. The 4 man fronts gave them fits.
The saddest thing in life is wasted talent and the choices you make will shape your life forever.
-Chazz Palminteri
cmoss84
Transition Player
Posts: 303
Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 1:29 pm
Location: Bakersfield, CA

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by cmoss84 »

Seems like great timing to go into our bye week. We've shown a lot of grit so far and have won in some tough situations. But we still have a long ways to go to be a force in the playoffs. If we can get home field advantage, we will be dangerous. Overall, a great start with the new staff. Let's get everyone rested up and healthy and get ready for Arizona. Hopkins will be back...but Hollywood is out. 6-1 would be sweet! Skol!!! :beerock:
I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.
J. Kapp 11
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9856
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:57 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:54 pm
J. Kapp 11 wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:47 pm
I wish I could get you access to the Tyler Dunne article about the culture, but it's very long and behind a paywall. It's so informative, full of direct quotes from players and coaches who endured last season. Guys hated coming to work last year. The atmosphere was toxic. They arrive at work early with KOC. The camaraderie seems obvious to me. They've got each other's backs. And I mean, look at Cousins when he gets faced with adversity. Obviously the Philly game is the exception, but otherwise he's bouncing back from adversity and interceptions in ways many of us never thought possible. In the Bears game, for example, he led that 17-play game-winning drive directly following his interception. In the past, he would have melted down. This time, he helped win the game. I believe that's culture and KOC's influence.

Unfortunately, I don't think Donatell has much to work with on defense. He simply can't blitz a lot ... if he asks his slow DBs and LBs to play man, the Vikings will get killed even worse than they are. I think he adjusted against the Dolphins by finally going to a 4-man front on passing downs. Helped turn up the pressure without having to blitz a ton (I think we had 25 pressures, and 22 came without the benefit of a blitz). He also adjusted against the Bears. Right after Fields broke off that long TD run that got called back by penalty, Donatell started using Brian Asamoah to spy Fields. Hoping he does more of that against Kyler Murray in a couple of weeks.
Yeah I've been noticing Asamoah out there more and more which I think is a good thing. It's weird, Hicks doesnt fair well in PFF but he 100% has a nose for the ball. He seems like he's always right there making plays. But I get that he definitely does lack sideline to sideline speed which is where Asamoah comes in.

I also think the more they allow Hunter to have his hand in the dirt, the better. The 4 man fronts gave them fits.
It's a conundrum with Asamoah and Hicks. Here's what I've been hearing.

Hicks isn't good in coverage. He's slow, and he's just not a good cover guy. However, he plays the run well, as you mentioned. Asamoah has the speed, but he's more downhill and side-to-side. Again, instinctively good against the run. But in coverage, he's inexperienced, and word is that in practice, he's prone to mistakes.

So which do you choose? Slow but experienced, or fast but mistake-prone? Tough question.

If the Vikings were 2-4, it would be easy ... get the rookie some experience. At 5-1 with a chance for the best record in the conference, it's a much more difficult choice. So far Donatell is taking the safe route. In the long run, though, I think the Vikings got themselves a good one in Asamoah. He's perfect for the modern game, that hybrid linebacker/safety who can really run and hit. Once he figures out what he's doing, he could end up being an animal.
Image
Go ahead. I dare you.
Underestimate this man.
psjordan
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1924
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2003 8:01 am

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by psjordan »

Hmmmm. I hate to be the "downer guy", but I was at the game with great seats, row 19 behind Vikes bench. Here are my thoughts.

I really did not like KOC's gameplan on offense nor his sideline approach. I came away really unimpressed with those aspects.

The Dolphins doubled us in yards gained for the game. They outpassed us something like 400 yards to 150 with a #3 rookie QB and a #2 QB coming off concussion.

Shortly into the 2nd quarter I took a picture of the stats on the scoreboard during a TV timeout. This is pre-Teddy time, Thompson might have had 400 yards passing on his own if he didn't get hurt:

Vikes | Dolphins
12 PLAYS 24
15 YARDS 138
0 1ST DOWNS 7
0 INTS 0
5:55 TOP 13:54

TWELVE PLAYS, FIFTEEN YARDS. Four possessions, four punts. I correctly guessed - or was darn close - on 6 of the 8 non-punting plays.

Only 5:55 TOP in the fist 20 minutes against a rookie QB who, again, looked like he was going to beat us like a drum while he was out there. MIA had the stones to have him pass on the first two plays - and 7 of the first 10. He made just a few critically bad decisions, as all rookie QB's do, and that cost him. But make no mistake, he was torching us early and often.

I counted three Tyreek Hill receptions where (by mistake or not), we had him "covered" by a LB.

Bradbury is the strangest OL to watch in the league. He got absolutely wrecked more than several times, then had a good play here and there. Very strange to watch in person. He looks like he weighs 100 lbs out there.

It was painfully apparent that a LARGE part of our success rushing the passer was due to the rookie being the rookie and Teddy still being out of sorts (or Teddy being Teddy, take your pick). Both QB's made bad decisions. We rarely made a great defensive play that I felt would have been a great defensive play against a top tier QB and/or offense. That's subjective, I know, but the eyeball test could not have been more apparent. Could we have been that successful against even a Tua type? My eyeballs said no, we would have been torched all game. Subjective and non-provable.

Our D did a very good job hanging in there, but I can tell you the DL was gassed after the first series of the game. We just sucked less in this department.

Not really breaking news, but man is Theilen hurt, and a gamer. Once or twice I thought no way he was going back to the huddle, but he gutted it out big time.

I need to think about this one, but I have to at least say it - Cousins has a very weird arc on the ball when he throws a pass less than 15-20 yards. I can't explain it without sounding like he's breaking the laws of physics. And I only had one beer. I'm going to think that one over and see if I can pin down what my eyes told my brain was going on.

We started the 2nd half with 4 of 5 possessions gaining a robust total of -5 yards (the 4th of the 5 possessions was the TD, helped by the 47 yarder to JJ). But of course we then missed the XP. Add all this to the gameplan at the start of the game and KOC didn't impress me at all with this effort.

The one thing that REALLY got to me is that more often than not KOC did not pay any attention - didn't even watch in fact - when our D was on the field. This drives me CRAZY in several aspects, not the least of which is that he's telling everyone on D from Donatell on down that "that D thing is on you guys". And the part that really, really bothers me is that as a coach I always watched my team on O and on D, no matter which group was "mine". If for no other reason than to learn what is or is not successful for the other team. Maybe he does all that in film study post-game (we could certainly use a few of the Dolphins pass patterns), but for a HC to not watch in real time and give inputs on adjustments during a game just cuts me to the bone.

I came away thinking we were very, VERY lucky to win that game, and by far the biggest issue I saw was gameplan related on O and scheme on D. We simply can't play that way and beat good teams.

No idea how the season progresses, but I've never been more nonplussed by a team with such a good record. I hope they prove me wrong when the going gets tougher.
J. Kapp 11
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9856
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:57 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

psjordan wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 4:12 pm Hmmmm. I hate to be the "downer guy", but I was at the game with great seats, row 19 behind Vikes bench. Here are my thoughts.

I really did not like KOC's gameplan on offense nor his sideline approach. I came away really unimpressed with those aspects.

The Dolphins doubled us in yards gained for the game. They outpassed us something like 400 yards to 150 with a #3 rookie QB and a #2 QB coming off concussion.

Shortly into the 2nd quarter I took a picture of the stats on the scoreboard during a TV timeout. This is pre-Teddy time, Thompson might have had 400 yards passing on his own if he didn't get hurt:

Vikes | Dolphins
12 PLAYS 24
15 YARDS 138
0 1ST DOWNS 7
0 INTS 0
5:55 TOP 13:54

TWELVE PLAYS, FIFTEEN YARDS. Four possessions, four punts. I correctly guessed - or was darn close - on 6 of the 8 non-punting plays.

Only 5:55 TOP in the fist 20 minutes against a rookie QB who, again, looked like he was going to beat us like a drum while he was out there. MIA had the stones to have him pass on the first two plays - and 7 of the first 10. He made just a few critically bad decisions, as all rookie QB's do, and that cost him. But make no mistake, he was torching us early and often.

I counted three Tyreek Hill receptions where (by mistake or not), we had him "covered" by a LB.

Bradbury is the strangest OL to watch in the league. He got absolutely wrecked more than several times, then had a good play here and there. Very strange to watch in person. He looks like he weighs 100 lbs out there.

It was painfully apparent that a LARGE part of our success rushing the passer was due to the rookie being the rookie and Teddy still being out of sorts (or Teddy being Teddy, take your pick). Both QB's made bad decisions. We rarely made a great defensive play that I felt would have been a great defensive play against a top tier QB and/or offense. That's subjective, I know, but the eyeball test could not have been more apparent. Could we have been that successful against even a Tua type? My eyeballs said no, we would have been torched all game. Subjective and non-provable.

Our D did a very good job hanging in there, but I can tell you the DL was gassed after the first series of the game. We just sucked less in this department.

Not really breaking news, but man is Theilen hurt, and a gamer. Once or twice I thought no way he was going back to the huddle, but he gutted it out big time.

I need to think about this one, but I have to at least say it - Cousins has a very weird arc on the ball when he throws a pass less than 15-20 yards. I can't explain it without sounding like he's breaking the laws of physics. And I only had one beer. I'm going to think that one over and see if I can pin down what my eyes told my brain was going on.

We started the 2nd half with 4 of 5 possessions gaining a robust total of -5 yards (the 4th of the 5 possessions was the TD, helped by the 47 yarder to JJ). But of course we then missed the XP. Add all this to the gameplan at the start of the game and KOC didn't impress me at all with this effort.

The one thing that REALLY got to me is that more often than not KOC did not pay any attention - didn't even watch in fact - when our D was on the field. This drives me CRAZY in several aspects, not the least of which is that he's telling everyone on D from Donatell on down that "that D thing is on you guys". And the part that really, really bothers me is that as a coach I always watched my team on O and on D, no matter which group was "mine". If for no other reason than to learn what is or is not successful for the other team. Maybe he does all that in film study post-game (we could certainly use a few of the Dolphins pass patterns), but for a HC to not watch in real time and give inputs on adjustments during a game just cuts me to the bone.

I came away thinking we were very, VERY lucky to win that game, and by far the biggest issue I saw was gameplan related on O and scheme on D. We simply can't play that way and beat good teams.

No idea how the season progresses, but I've never been more nonplussed by a team with such a good record. I hope they prove me wrong when the going gets tougher.
I can see why you would come away with a negative outlook on the offense. The game didn’t start well. The fact is that Mike McDaniel poured a bucket of ice water on the Vikings opening script. According to The Athletic, Miami came into the game having played 3 down linemen and 4 linebackers on 2 of 175 plays against 11 personnel. O’Connell saw this as a tendency and planned accordingly. But McDaniel threw the Vikings a curve. They went 3-4 every time the Vikings went with 11 personnel. The opening script was kaput.

But O’Connell eventually adjusted. The Vikings did much better in the second half. They averaged almost 7 yards per play on first down.

The NFL this year is anything but pretty. Teams are savvy, and they’re evenly matched. The Dolphins have talented personnel on defense, and they have smart coaches. The fact that KOC adjusted and won the game, to me, speaks well of him. McDaniel got him at first and won the battle, but KOC won the war.

As for paying attention to the defense, the Vikings were so bad on offense that I can see how his attention would be taken away. That said, it’s something to keep an eye on.
Image
Go ahead. I dare you.
Underestimate this man.
User avatar
VikingLord
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8616
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 3:12 pm
Location: The Land of the Ice and Snow

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by VikingLord »

Freely admit I didn't watch the game, which is part of the reason I've had no comment on it thus far. And a win in the NFL is a win no matter how it is sliced. A road win is even bigger. So I'm glad they won and impressed they won even if it wasn't pretty.

But man, the stats in this game were fugly. If I saw that stat line for both teams and nothing else, I would think the Vikings didn't just lose, but were blown out. And, as others have noted, Miami was starting a true no-namer 3rd stringer at QB, which should have been as much a problem for Miami's offensive production as anything the Vikings might have managed to create with their defense.

So I'm torn a bit with this performance, especially after their relative improvement I hoped had started with the win against the Saints. While this was a win and the offense and defense managed some big plays, it still seems like a step back in terms of the trend I was hoping to see.

For the record, I see the core of a good team. I see a team that is managing to execute in critical moments on both sides of the ball for the most part. I see a team that seems to have enough talent to make the big plays on both sides of the ball. So I'm happy about that and I think the record reflects that talent level and potential. But they're still not clicking yet. The consistency isn't there and while they've managed to win in spite of that, there has to come a time when they start to put it together for an entire game.

If there is a time in a season where struggling with consistency is OK, the first half of the season is it. If there is a point in the season where a team needs to win ugly a few times, the first half is it. And if there is a point in the season where a team needs to start demonstrating it can put the pieces together into a cohesive, consistent approach, well, that time is almost here for the Vikings. For me to get fully on board with believing in this team is going to take me seeing several games where the consistency and production are both there. I am optimistic that will start happening, because I really, really want to believe in this team this year.

Anyway, for those of you who saw the game, I truly appreciate reading the comments and insights. It provides a lot of context.

One last thing I wanted to say was about Dalvin Cook and how nice it was to see him break one finally. He's looked frustrated because it always seems like there is one last guy who just trips him up and prevents him from breaking off the long TD run. He finally found the daylight he needed to avoid that, and it was great to see him capitalize and take it all the way. He's got a ton of talent and he's a guy I really want to root for and hope he succeeds.
User avatar
IIsweet
Pro Bowl Elite Player
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:02 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by IIsweet »

So I was at the game and the stats were very accurate but in the end misleading IMO.
In the 1st quarter, we were absolutely obliterated. The only reason that we were even in the game was due to Miami constantly drawing penalty flags.
However, the minute Teddy came into the game, in the 2nd quarter, I felt the Vikings took control of the game. The passing stats that Teddy put up are also very misleading. The majority of his yards were YAC yards by Hill and Waddle. Waddle took a Hitch and went like 50 yards with it. Hill did catch a few 15-20 yard passes in soft zone, but he also took off and added a bunch of YAC.
BTW, Hill made Chandler Sullivan look absolutely elementary on 1 play. Like Sullivan was a Pop Warner football player. Afetr taking a 2 score lead, the defense became very much a bend but don't break defense. It was designed to keep the play in front of the defender and keep the clock running. Miami went right down the field in 3 or 4 plays !!! Our DB speed is pedestrian !

I noticed also KOC with his head down not watching the defense, but let's be real, he is the play caller on offense! He has to get it right. Heck, if you don't score, it's impossible to win !!! So it doesn't bother me that he did this.

The fans around me were so disgusted with so many of Cousins check downs and terrible throws. We were all commenting on Captain Checkdown, and Keeping that completion % high, etc.... It was brutal how numerous times the throws were so bad to not even get to the 1st down marker. For instance the poor pass to Thielen on 3rd and 2. Seriously a terrible throw that Thielen dove for and it was still 2 yards behind the 1st down marker. Constant checkdowns and throw aways. The 1 play that stood out so much to me was when we were out of FG range, 3rd and long, he had KJ 1on 1 on a 9 route and instead of throwing the ball into space and giving KJ a chance to make a play on it, he checked down and threw a pass out of bounds. Why? We had to punt regardless. Why not take the chance to see if your WR can beat the CB. Maybe even get a PI !!
Pondering Her Percy
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9241
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:38 am
Location: Watertown, NY

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 1:50 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 12:54 pm

Yeah I've been noticing Asamoah out there more and more which I think is a good thing. It's weird, Hicks doesnt fair well in PFF but he 100% has a nose for the ball. He seems like he's always right there making plays. But I get that he definitely does lack sideline to sideline speed which is where Asamoah comes in.

I also think the more they allow Hunter to have his hand in the dirt, the better. The 4 man fronts gave them fits.
It's a conundrum with Asamoah and Hicks. Here's what I've been hearing.

Hicks isn't good in coverage. He's slow, and he's just not a good cover guy. However, he plays the run well, as you mentioned. Asamoah has the speed, but he's more downhill and side-to-side. Again, instinctively good against the run. But in coverage, he's inexperienced, and word is that in practice, he's prone to mistakes.

So which do you choose? Slow but experienced, or fast but mistake-prone? Tough question.

If the Vikings were 2-4, it would be easy ... get the rookie some experience. At 5-1 with a chance for the best record in the conference, it's a much more difficult choice. So far Donatell is taking the safe route. In the long run, though, I think the Vikings got themselves a good one in Asamoah. He's perfect for the modern game, that hybrid linebacker/safety who can really run and hit. Once he figures out what he's doing, he could end up being an animal.
Yeah I'm actually really excited about Asamoah. Watching his tape at OU, the guy just has freakish speed but you are correct, there's an inexperience factor. However, against scrambling QBs (like Murray next week), I think I would prefer Asamoah. If it's against your more traditional style QB, yeah I'd go with Hicks. I'll actually be at that Arizona game and will have a front a center view of how this plays out. Flying up and staying with Kramer that weekend!
The saddest thing in life is wasted talent and the choices you make will shape your life forever.
-Chazz Palminteri
J. Kapp 11
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9856
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:57 pm

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:38 am
J. Kapp 11 wrote: Tue Oct 18, 2022 1:50 pm
It's a conundrum with Asamoah and Hicks. Here's what I've been hearing.

Hicks isn't good in coverage. He's slow, and he's just not a good cover guy. However, he plays the run well, as you mentioned. Asamoah has the speed, but he's more downhill and side-to-side. Again, instinctively good against the run. But in coverage, he's inexperienced, and word is that in practice, he's prone to mistakes.

So which do you choose? Slow but experienced, or fast but mistake-prone? Tough question.

If the Vikings were 2-4, it would be easy ... get the rookie some experience. At 5-1 with a chance for the best record in the conference, it's a much more difficult choice. So far Donatell is taking the safe route. In the long run, though, I think the Vikings got themselves a good one in Asamoah. He's perfect for the modern game, that hybrid linebacker/safety who can really run and hit. Once he figures out what he's doing, he could end up being an animal.
Yeah I'm actually really excited about Asamoah. Watching his tape at OU, the guy just has freakish speed but you are correct, there's an inexperience factor. However, against scrambling QBs (like Murray next week), I think I would prefer Asamoah. If it's against your more traditional style QB, yeah I'd go with Hicks. I'll actually be at that Arizona game and will have a front a center view of how this plays out. Flying up and staying with Kramer that weekend!
I’ll be there too.

Have a great time with Touchdown Tommy!
Image
Go ahead. I dare you.
Underestimate this man.
Pondering Her Percy
Hall of Famer
Posts: 9241
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:38 am
Location: Watertown, NY

Re: Vikings @ Dolphins post game

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Wed Oct 19, 2022 12:05 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:38 am

Yeah I'm actually really excited about Asamoah. Watching his tape at OU, the guy just has freakish speed but you are correct, there's an inexperience factor. However, against scrambling QBs (like Murray next week), I think I would prefer Asamoah. If it's against your more traditional style QB, yeah I'd go with Hicks. I'll actually be at that Arizona game and will have a front a center view of how this plays out. Flying up and staying with Kramer that weekend!
I’ll be there too.

Have a great time with Touchdown Tommy!
Message me brother! Would love to meet up!
The saddest thing in life is wasted talent and the choices you make will shape your life forever.
-Chazz Palminteri
Post Reply