Cordarrelle Patterson

[Mothman]

I get the interest Jim, But that is why we have coaches. Because we cant have 3 million jim's coaching from the sidelines.

I'm not trying to coach, just wishing we had more information and I'd say what I'm asking is why we have reporters, not coaches. They're supposed to ask the questions that answer our questions. Unfortunately, I get the impression there's something akin to a moratorium on discussing details related this subject. After all, a first round draft pick has been sitting on the bench all year while the offense struggled and there's been barely a whisper about it from the press.

For me its as Simple as; I trust Zimmer and Patterson isn't on the field, therefore, he shouldn't be on the field.

There is some stuff you will never be privy to unless you come up with 300 million to invest in the Vikings.

I'm workin' on it... meanwhile, I'm curious by nature.

Thanks, I appreciate the clarification.

I enjoyed your summation. I'm not personally interested in delving too far into the unknown aspects. I'm more of less content to agree with Zimmer that "At the end of the day, it's really up to him" whether thats mental and/or physical.

It sounds like Seamus feels similarly. I just don't have that level of confidence in Zimmer's judgment yet, especially when it comes to offense because another aspect of the team I'm unclear about it is just how much autonomy Turner has been given with that unit.

It indicates motivation as the underlying problem in my view.

That's one way to interpret it but I don't think it's the only way. For example, ""At the end of the day, it's really up to him" could just as easily mean it's up to Patterson to achieve whatever standard has been set for him. It may have nothing to do with his motivation or effort to achieve that standard, just results.

As far as what it indicates that a talented player is kept off the field, I view it as a huge positive about the standards of the coaching staff and the respect they have for their players and their team who are there grinding away in the classroom AND on the practice field. To me trying to milk Patterson's athleticism for a big play here or there without holding him to the same standards is taking the quick buck at the expense of the culture required to build a championship team.

Yes, you've said that before and it strikes me as a perspective rooted in confidence in the head coach's judgment (and an assumed lack of effort on Patterson's part). Keeping a talented player off the field can just as easily be indicative of poor judgment or mismanagement.

[Raptorman]

Some players never grasp the concept of what goes on in the NFL. It is very different than college ball. They can run and catch, but the idea of the concept of the scheme escapes them. And then you get those that get it, but can't catch.

[Mothman]

Some players never grasp the concept of what goes on in the NFL. It is very different than college ball. They can run and catch, but the idea of the concept of the scheme escapes them. And then you get those that get it, but can't catch.

I have to say, I understand it. Some of these offenses sound pretty confusing. I can see how it would take a while to learn them, especially for players who haven't been getting acclimated to increasingly complex offenses over the course of their high school and college careers.

[fiestavike]

Yes, you've said that before and it strikes me as a perspective rooted in confidence in the head coach's judgment (and an assumed lack of effort on Patterson's part). Keeping a talented player off the field can just as easily be indicative of poor judgment or mismanagement.

Put another way, the willingness to keep a talented player off the field is an essential element in establishing leadership and credibility. You are right that I think its a positive in this case because I have confidence in Zimmer. If it were Brad Childress keeping a talented player off the field I would be much less confident.
Based on Zimmer's track record and testimonials of past/current players I'm not sure why you wouldn't have confidence in him. Like I said, nobody is complaining about playing time on this team, and there are guys who might be peeved about how little they've seen the field. You don't develop that kind of culture without a lot of credibility as a head coach.

You say it could just as easily indicate poor judgement, but in this particular case do you feel you have any reason to believe that is what's happening? I just don't get it.

[vatusay]

Wasnt the knock on him out of college was an inability to learn the position?

The talking heads always label these guys as "raw".

Id say everyone knew the problem before he was drafted. I dont think its hard to figure out.

[losperros]

Wasnt the knock on him out of college was an inability to learn the position?

The talking heads always label these guys as "raw".

Id say everyone knew the problem before he was drafted. I dont think its hard to figure out.

Somebody forgot to tell Patterson that during his rookie season. He made big plays and scored TDs as a returner, receiver, and even from the RB position. Seems to me that Patterson must know something about playing football because he can do things other players can't.

Personally, I don't give a rat's #### if Patterson is a schematic genius or not. If he can create big plays and score points to help the team win, as he did during his rookie season, then he should be out on the field. CP doesn't have to start but he should at least get some touches.

[Mothman]

Put another way, the willingness to keep a talented player off the field is an essential element in establishing leadership and credibility.

On that, we agree.

You are right that I think its a positive in this case because I have confidence in Zimmer. If it were Brad Childress keeping a talented player off the field I would be much less confident.
Based on Zimmer's track record and testimonials of past/current players I'm not sure why you wouldn't have confidence in him. Like I said, nobody is complaining about playing time on this team, and there are guys who might be peeved about how little they've seen the field. You don't develop that kind of culture without a lot of credibility as a head coach.

You say it could just as easily indicate poor judgement, but in this particular case do you feel you have any reason to believe that is what's happening? I just don't get it.

As I said earlier, I'm not looking to blame anybody, just for a better understanding of what's going on and what, if anything, is being done about it. In other words, I don't believe in any particular scenario here, I just want answers,, and preferably progress.

[losperros]

Well, this is cool. Now we have two Vikings players voted to the All-Pro NFL Team by the Pro Football Writers of America! Adrian Peterson at RB and Cordarrelle Patterson as the kick returner. I still wish Harrison Smith would have made it, but I think the injury bug kept him out.

Patterson, meanwhile, was likely not quite as obvious of a choice. But his strength at returning kicks drew attention from around the league. Patterson led the NFL with an average of 31.8 yards per kickoff return, and his 1,019 total kick return yards were second only to Ameer Abdullah, who had five more attempts but a lower average than Patterson. Only six players returned a kick for a touchdown, and Patterson was the only player to do it twice.

Thanks in part to Patterson, the Vikings’ special teams ranked 10th in the NFL this year, according to a study in the Dallas Morning News.

http://www.1500espn.com/vikings-2/2016/ ... f-america/

[Pondering Her Percy]

Well, this is cool. Now we have two Vikings players voted to the All-Pro NFL Team by the Pro Football Writers of America! Adrian Peterson at RB and Cordarrelle Patterson as the kick returner. I still wish Harrison Smith would have made it, but I think the injury bug kept him out.
http://www.1500espn.com/vikings-2/2016/ ... f-america/

With him being such an elusive playmaker, it really does drive me nuts we don't utilize him on offense. We don't have to turn him into some kind of WR but utilize him like Percy Harvin or Tavon Austin. It's just stupid to not put a guy like that on offense. He's too dangerous in open space. I understand the coaching staff is probably sick of him but it puts another threat on the field outside of AP

[slapnut19]

some of you seem to forget that patterson was on the field quite a bit in 2014. he had two more rushing attempts than he had as a rookie and was targeted 67 times as wr which was 2nd most on the team to jennings. so in summary he was given every opportunity by the coaches in a full season to make an impact and really didn't stand out outside of one run vs the rams. i'm really not going to worry about him dropping on the depth chart when we just had a division championship 11 win season. out of our five losses i don't see one of them where he would have been the difference.

[slapnut19]

in a perfect world patterson developing into a better wr would be the best thing to happen to the offense. they could dump wallace and save the 11 mil plus not be pressured into pursuing another vet or drafting one high out of need. remember the pressure to give ponder better targets is what got us jennings and patterson to start with.


i also agree though that if they don't see him as a long term viable option then trade him for whatever you can get and move on, but if they are both content with him being just a kick returner then let it ride and upgrade the receivers another way.

[Mothman]

some of you seem to forget that patterson was on the field quite a bit in 2014. he had two more rushing attempts than he had as a rookie and was targeted 67 times as wr which was 2nd most on the team to jennings. so in summary he was given every opportunity by the coaches in a full season to make an impact and really didn't stand out outside of one run vs the rams. i'm really not going to worry about him dropping on the depth chart when we just had a division championship 11 win season. out of our five losses i don't see one of them where he would have been the difference.

They lost 2 of those games by just 3 points so it's not hard to do the math and imagine that one more big play might have mattered.

I doubt anybody has forgotten that Patterson played in 2014. He started for about half of the season, played with a hip injury for part of it, and was eventually supplanted in the lineup by Johnson. He didn't make much of an impact (though he was missed more than once when open downfield) but then again, receivers seem to have a hard time making an impact for long in the Vikings current offense.

[Mothman]

Well, this is cool. Now we have two Vikings players voted to the All-Pro NFL Team by the Pro Football Writers of America! Adrian Peterson at RB and Cordarrelle Patterson as the kick returner. I still wish Harrison Smith would have made it, but I think the injury bug kept him out.
http://www.1500espn.com/vikings-2/2016/ ... f-america/

Congrats to Patterson!

[mondry]

It's tough to say without knowing more obviously but if I had to take a stab in the dark I'd guess that Patterson is just too "simple" to grasp a complex NFL offense. On the flip side Norv is too loyal to his offense and so set in trying to make it work the exact way he thinks it's suppose to work that he doesn't notice that if he went off course or outside the box just a little bit a guy like Patterson would still be an asset.

Zimmer hasn't dropped the hammer on Norv because Norv's convinced him that Patterson is a liability and that it's all Patterson's fault for not training with Irvin and perhaps one or two other minor instances (due to Patterson's simpleness, happy go lucky, light hearted attitude he "appears" to not be taking things seriously enough) and Norv has built his case on those things thus Patterson is in the dog house.

It's an absolute shame that his career has gone this way. When we run on 68% of first downs and there's 9 guys in the box loaded up for AD getting the ball to Patterson out in space even on a short pass would be deadly. Let's not forget that when patterson struggled, he was dealing with an injury and AD was suspended so defenses could key in on him. When he and AD have played together though he's had his best games. All he needs is a tiny sliver of day light (which is why he's such a good kick returner) and playing with AD creates a lot of space for him.

But like I said, that is just a guess and I don't like Norv so I'd love to put the blame on him. This guy is just something else, he says #### like "Charles Johnson is the best WR on the team" and helps him disappear into an inactive role. When he first signed here he says "Can't wait to put 15 Patterson specific plays in!" and then puts zero Patterson plays in and helps him disappear too. I guess both of these guys just forgot how to play over night... Nah... my guess is it's more political than anything else, Norv simply found some "illogical" excuse to phase them out.

[autobon7]

It's tough to say without knowing more obviously but if I had to take a stab in the dark I'd guess that Patterson is just too "simple" to grasp a complex NFL offense. On the flip side Norv is too loyal to his offense and so set in trying to make it work the exact way he thinks it's suppose to work that he doesn't notice that if he went off course or outside the box just a little bit a guy like Patterson would still be an asset.

Zimmer hasn't dropped the hammer on Norv because Norv's convinced him that Patterson is a liability and that it's all Patterson's fault for not training with Irvin and perhaps one or two other minor instances (due to Patterson's simpleness, happy go lucky, light hearted attitude he "appears" to not be taking things seriously enough) and Norv has built his case on those things thus Patterson is in the dog house.

It's an absolute shame that his career has gone this way. When we run on 68% of first downs and there's 9 guys in the box loaded up for AD getting the ball to Patterson out in space even on a short pass would be deadly. Let's not forget that when patterson struggled, he was dealing with an injury and AD was suspended so defenses could key in on him. When he and AD have played together though he's had his best games. All he needs is a tiny sliver of day light (which is why he's such a good kick returner) and playing with AD creates a lot of space for him.

But like I said, that is just a guess and I don't like Norv so I'd love to put the blame on him. This guy is just something else, he says #### like "Charles Johnson is the best WR on the team" and helps him disappear into an inactive role. When he first signed here he says "Can't wait to put 15 Patterson specific plays in!" and then puts zero Patterson plays in and helps him disappear too. I guess both of these guys just forgot how to play over night... Nah... my guess is it's more political than anything else, Norv simply found some "illogical" excuse to phase them out.

(((((( THIS ))))))......I know we are kind of speculating but this is what my gut has been telling me all along. I have the feeling that (as Mondry said above) that it may be a little of both. Patterson still trying to grasp and Norv being a stubborn old goat. Like Mondry I'm not a Norv fan so I lay a larger portion of the blame on him. He just doesn't seem like a flexible kind of guy. With Zim being a defensive mind I see why he "handed the keys" to Norv.....but lots and lots of Charger fans warned us about Norv when he signed with the Viks. I remember spending a couple days reading at least a dozen Viks and Chargers forums to gather intel from fans regarding Norv and his tendencies. I have to say that FAR more were negative than positive. Even tho memory is not what it used to be I would guess 85% negative to 15% positive. Which rained on my parade because I was so happy that we didn't have Musgrave to deal with anymore. I don't see Zim moving away from Norv anytime in the near future so our offense is hitched to the Norv wagon train for now.